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[EN/ESP] The most impactful Pokemon on the new meta with the hidden abilities - Chart!


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I thought this would be useful! Please note that there is a color legend (that with your feedback, hopefully, will be enriched with other tiers). There will be a Spanish translation for every ability in the table. 

(Pensé que esto sería de gran ayuda. Por favor, tengan en cuenta que hay una leyenda de colores que con su ayuda se expandirá también a las demás tiers. Hay una traducción en español para cada habilidad en la tabla). 

 

 

 

Hidden abilities (habilidades ocultas)

Blue: OU + DBS

Green: OU

Lightish brown: DBS

Ubers or will not be added for competitive play

 

The Pokemon that are highlighted with the respective colors will be, in my opinion, the ones that will have the most impact on the metagame. 

(Los pokemones que están resaltados con los colores respectivos serán, en mi opinión, los que tendrán el mayor impacto en el meta actual).

 

Cheers ?

 

*Thanks to @OrangeManiac and @DiosSlurpuff for their feedback.

 

Moxie (Autoestima)

Regenerator

(regeneración)

Technician

(Experto)

Prankster

(bromista)

Magic bounce (espejo mágico)

Moldbreaker

(rompemoldes)

Salamence

image.png

Amoonguss

image.png

Breloom

image.png

Sableye

image.png

Espeon

image.png

Excadrill

image.png

Heracross

image.png

Tangrowth

image.png

Roserade

image.png

Liepard

image.png

Xatu                        

image.png

Druddigon

image.png

Pinsir

image.png

Slowking

image.png

 

Riolu

image.png

 

 

Gyarados

image.png

Slowbro

image.png

 

Murkrow

image.png

 

 

Honchkrow

image.png

Reuniclus

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Alomomola

 image.png

 

 

 

 

Analytic

(cálculo final)

 

Rough skin

(Piel tosca)

Sheer force (fuerza bruta)

Magic guard (muro mágico)

Iron Fist (puño férreo)

Multiscale (compensación)

Magnezone

image.png

Garchomp

image.png

Nidoking

image.png

Alakazam

image.png

Infernape

image.png

Dragonite

image.png

Starmie

image.png

 

Nidoqueen

image.png

 

Conkeldurr

image.png

 

Porygon-Z

image.png

 

Feraligatr

image.png

 

Hitmonchan

image.png

 

Porygon2

image.png

 

Tauros

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Hariyama

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Kingler

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Rampardos

image.png

 

 

 

Thick Fat (sebo)

Drought (sequía) 

Drizzle (llovizna)

Rain dish (cura lluvia)

Chlorophyll (clorofila)

Adaptability

(adaptable)

Mamoswine

image.png

Ninetales

image.png

Politoad

image.png

Tentacruel

image.png.b3f0c955ff10ac783b8f4c82c8b723cc.png

Venusaur

image.png

Crawdaunt

image.png

Lightning rod (pararrayos)

Sap Sipper (herbívoro)

Harvest (cosecha)

Unburden (liviano)

Speed boost (impulso)

Contrary (respondón)

Raichu

image.png

Azumarill

image.png

Exeggutor

image.png

Sceptile

image.png

Blaziken

image.png

Serperior

image.png

Pachirisu

image.png

Miltank

image.png

 

Hitmonlee

image.png

 

 

Moody (veleta)

Shadowtag (sombra trampa)

Frisk (cacheo)

Poison Heal (antídoto)

Infiltrator (allanamiento)

Unaware (ignorante)

Glalie

image.png

Gothitelle

image.png

Dusclops

image.png

Gliscor

image.png

Chandelure

image.png

Clefable

image.png

Smeargle

image.png

 

 

 

Crobat

image.png

Quagsire

image.png

Solar Power (poder solar)

Skill link (encadenado)

Reckless (audaz)

Friend guard (compiescolta)

Gluttony (gula)

Defiant (competitivo)

Charizard

image.png

Ambipom

image.png

Staraptor

image.png

Clefairy

image.png

Snorlax

image.png

Braviary

image.png

 

Cinccino

image.png

Rhyperior

image.png

 

 

Empoleon

image.png

Water Absorb (absorbe agua)

No guard (indefenso)

Inner focus (foco interno)

Zen mode (modo daruma)

Guts (agallas)

Scrappy (intrépido)

Seismitoad

image.png

Golurk

image.png

Kangashkan

image.png

Darmanitan

image.png

Luxray

image.png

Exploud

image.png

Lanturn

image.png

 

 

 

 

Stoutland

image.png

Cacturne

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Clear body (cuerpo puro)

Storm drain (colector)

Intimidate (intimidación)

Imposter (impostor)

 

 

Klinklang

image.png

Cradily

image.png

Scrafty

image.png

Ditto

image.png.0ec3db8d88d1d3061cc8120ef083e8f5.png

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by astarmentor
Link to comment
  • astarmentor changed the title to [EN/ESP] The most impactful Pokemon on the new meta with the hidden abilities - Chart!

Good idea, although I disagree on some points, I will share my point of view:

I doubt that Xatu will have a significant role in OU, I would say that at best he could be the ''Espeon of UU''

Serperior Contrary might have some impact on dubs, as there are allies with Follow Me.

You shouldn't forget or rule out P2 with analytic, which while it's currently better capable, might surprise you.

Crobat I think that if it will have an impact on OU with infiltrator, since it would be a perfect check for Breloom

I doubt that Sableye will have an impact on OU, since prankster prevents sinister pokemon from being used for status moves, and if Sableye is taken into account, we should not forget about Murkrow either (Which would be a gimmick at most, I don't know I don't think relevant, but should not be forgotten)

And correct me if I'm wrong, but PZ's hidden ability as far as I know is analytical.

Link to comment

Some thoughts from me as well, mostly from Doubles perspective:

 

- "Competitive" only exists XY onwards so I doubt we will get Competitive Milotic

- Gyarados will also get a noticable buff in Doubles. I am still unsure if Intimidate or Moxie is the better ability (depends of your team I suppose) but if you go full on the set up, Moxie can be great. But beyond that, Raichu's Lightningrod might arguably be the biggest thing buffing Gyarados.

- Regen might slightly buff bulky variants of Reuniclus, Slowking and Slowbro even in Doubles

- Nidoking becomes threatening in Doubles as well. Sheer Force Nidoking has proven itself quite of a strong Pokemon with both Life Orb and Choice Scarf in VGC 2018 metagame and looking at MMO meta, it basically heavily pressurizes everything below base 80 speed.

- I agree with above comment that Serperior would also become very powerful in Doubles

- Adaptability Crawdaunt becomes viable especially in Singles but I'd say it has its niche in Doubles too. It jumped to Gen 6 UU when it got Adaptability which makes me think it could have potential to gain OU usage.

- Sableye might have a niche at Doubles

- I am also hopeful of Empoleon becoming a good pick in Doubles. It has a great defensive typing already, basically shutting down 4/6 out of Standard rain team and heavily countering things like Crobat, Salamence or Hydreigon. Accidental Defiant boost can make Empoleon quite of a threat on the field and Roost also gives it very annoying longevity, I mean Milotic isn't awful in Doubles and it would become just the better version of it.

- Scrafty gets Intimidate which makes it in some cases a potential competitor for Hitmontop slot in Doubles

- I really doubt they will ever release Speed Boost Blaziken due to being easily Uber, also Shadow Tag Gothitelle while nerfed by the 3 turn rule might be deemed a bit unnecessary

- Oh my lord if we ever would get Moody Smeargle Doubles would become hilarious (no seriously please don't do it, I'm begging you)

 

Edited by OrangeManiac
Link to comment
10 hours ago, DiosSlurpuff said:

Good idea, although I disagree on some points, I will share my point of view:

I doubt that Xatu will have a significant role in OU, I would say that at best he could be the ''Espeon of UU''

Serperior Contrary might have some impact on dubs, as there are allies with Follow Me.

You shouldn't forget or rule out P2 with analytic, which while it's currently better capable, might surprise you.

Crobat I think that if it will have an impact on OU with infiltrator, since it would be a perfect check for Breloom

I doubt that Sableye will have an impact on OU, since prankster prevents sinister pokemon from being used for status moves, and if Sableye is taken into account, we should not forget about Murkrow either (Which would be a gimmick at most, I don't know I don't think relevant, but should not be forgotten)

And correct me if I'm wrong, but PZ's hidden ability as far as I know is analytical.

Noted! Will fix the chart in the following hours ? Ty for your input.

 

* I speculated that Xatu could be a surprising pivot (in every tier) because it has access to both u-turn and teleport. And its move pool is not half bad. The flying weakness tho and the fact that except for the defense stat, Espeon is superior. 

 

* I can see the leafstorm spam being viable. The following Pokemon come to mind for checking serp: Crobat, rotom H, rotom M, sala, ferro.  Everything else gets nuked with ease.

"+6 252 SpA Serperior Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Crobat: 91-108 (56.8 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO"

"+6 252 SpA Serperior Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Salamence: 91-108 (53.5 - 63.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO"

"+6 252 SpA Serperior Leaf Storm vs. 252 HP / 200+ SpD Ferrothorn: 52-62 (28.7 - 34.2%) -- 99.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery"

at plus +6 with only 252 hp, it KOs both rooms lol. 

 

*Oh shoot. Missed that (analytic -porygons). Will be included. 

 

* I believe as well that the inner focus overall will take their counterpart abilities asap in OU. I mean the crobat inclusion might shift the use of the sub most common users: volcarona, breloom, chandelure.

"252 Atk Crobat Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Chandelure: 88-105 (65.1 - 77.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery"

"252 Atk Crobat Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Volcarona: 152-180 (79.1 - 93.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO" (the off-chance that is the bulky volc 252hp, 252def).

 

* I thought that sableye would be very impactful because it has the priority wisp for scizor, it hard checks conk with prankster recovery, and t-tars pursuit's is not super effective. 

"252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Pursuit (40 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Sableye: 51-60 (32.4 - 38.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after sandstorm damage" (so switching will be - 68ish% I believe).

pivoting however: "252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Sableye: 73-87 (46.4 - 55.4%) -- 67.6% chance to 2HKO". And that's a big issue. 

 

*Will add Murkrow and its gimmicks. OMG I FORGOT PRANKSTER RIOLU!!!!!!

 

Link to comment
9 hours ago, OrangeManiac said:

Some thoughts from me as well, mostly from Doubles perspective:

 

- "Competitive" only exists XY onwards so I doubt we will get Competitive Milotic

- Gyarados will also get a noticable buff in Doubles. I am still unsure if Intimidate or Moxie is the better ability (depends of your team I suppose) but if you go full on the set up, Moxie can be great. But beyond that, Raichu's Lightningrod might arguably be the biggest thing buffing Gyarados.

- Regen might slightly buff bulky variants of Reuniclus, Slowking and Slowbro even in Doubles

- Nidoking becomes threatening in Doubles as well. Sheer Force Nidoking has proven itself quite of a strong Pokemon with both Life Orb and Choice Scarf in VGC 2018 metagame and looking at MMO meta, it basically heavily pressurizes everything below base 80 speed.

- I agree with above comment that Serperior would also become very powerful in Doubles

- Adaptability Crawdaunt becomes viable especially in Singles but I'd say it has its niche in Doubles too. It jumped to Gen 6 UU when it got Adaptability which makes me think it could have potential to gain OU usage.

- Sableye might have a niche at Doubles

- I am also hopeful of Empoleon becoming a good pick in Doubles. It has a great defensive typing already, basically shutting down 4/6 out of Standard rain team and heavily countering things like Crobat, Salamence or Hydreigon. Accidental Defiant boost can make Empoleon quite of a threat on the field and Roost also gives it very annoying longevity, I mean Milotic isn't awful in Doubles and it would become just the better version of it.

- Scrafty gets Intimidate which makes it in some cases a potential competitor for Hitmontop slot in Doubles

- I really doubt they will ever release Speed Boost Blaziken due to being easily Uber, also Shadow Tag Gothitelle while nerfed by the 3 turn rule might be deemed a bit unnecessary

- Oh my lord if we ever would get Moody Smeargle Doubles would become hilarious (no seriously please don't do it, I'm begging you)

 

Noted! Will fix the chart in the following hours ? Ty for your input.

 

* Ah, shoot. Was excited for milo ?

* Agreed. Still believe that the fixation on the taunt-t-wave defensive gyara will rule still. 

* That's were I cannot quite agree with you. Taunt would really nerf both slowing and slowbro, however, once you have figured it out what ability its running it could be too late. lol. so the bluff battles and the mind games will be real. So there's a strong point for the regen bros. Nevertheless, magic guard is too strong for reuni, and the game is too fast paced for us to set up and recycle reuni, unless we are running some kind of doubles-stall. Specs/life orb could be actually good. 

* Yeah, but it wishes to run 2 hidden powers. lol. but yeah. 

* No question. It will uprise to UUBL at the very least. Craw is way to strong. Some call him (me), the new weavile. Please elaborate how Craw could be used in doubles.

* And riolu (w/ coaching), and liepard, but I don't know to what extent.

* I believe that empo will not be as relevant because of defiant.  Roost, icy wind/beam, scald seem to be mandatory on the support set (roar, toxic, protect, stealth rocks, grass knot, some hidden power). Probably it could have a nice use on a full offensive set. 

* Wolfey flashbacks. Yup. I didn't include it right away because crobat and shao are waaaay to prominent. However it has a way better match up against the ghosts unlike hitmontop.

* People are excited for the speed boost, tho. I believe the same can be applied to darm-zen mode.

* I mean, goth has access too fake out and other damaging moves - unlike wobbuffet- and it can be really punishing as a lead or late game in dobs with the right partner despite the 3 turn clause.

* Its coming. Brace yourself. 

Link to comment
On 6/10/2022 at 3:51 AM, astarmentor said:

I thought this would be useful! Please note that there is a color legend (that with your feedback, hopefully, will be enriched with other tiers). There will be a Spanish translation for every ability in the table. 

(Pensé que esto sería de gran ayuda. Por favor, tengan en cuenta que hay una leyenda de colores que con su ayuda se expandirá también a las demás tiers. Hay una traducción en español para cada habilidad en la tabla). 

 

 

 

Hidden abilities (habilidades ocultas)

Blue: OU + DBS

Green: OU

Lightish brown: DBS

Ubers or will not be added for competitive play

 

The Pokemon that are highlighted with the respective colors will be, in my opinion, the ones that will have the most impact on the metagame. 

(Los pokemones que están resaltados con los colores respectivos serán, en mi opinión, los que tendrán el mayor impacto en el meta actual).

 

Cheers ?

 

*Thanks to @OrangeManiac and @DiosSlurpuff for their feedback.

 

Moxie (Autoestima)

Regenerator

(regeneración)

Technician

(Experto)

Prankster

(bromista)

Magic bounce (espejo mágico)

Moldbreaker

(rompemoldes)

Salamence

image.png

Amoonguss

image.png

Breloom

image.png

Sableye

image.png

Espeon

image.png

Excadrill

image.png

Heracross

image.png

Tangrowth

image.png

Roserade

image.png

Liepard

image.png

Xatu                        

image.png

Druddigon

image.png

Pinsir

image.png

Slowking

image.png

 

Riolu

image.png

 

 

Gyarados

image.png

Slowbro

image.png

 

Murkrow

image.png

 

 

Honchkrow

image.png

Reuniclus

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Alomomola

 image.png

 

 

 

 

Analytic

(cálculo final)

 

Rough skin

(Piel tosca)

Sheer force (fuerza bruta)

Magic guard (muro mágico)

Iron Fist (puño férreo)

Multiscale (compensación)

Magnezone

image.png

Garchomp

image.png

Nidoking

image.png

Alakazam

image.png

Infernape

image.png

Dragonite

image.png

Starmie

image.png

 

Nidoqueen

image.png

 

Conkeldurr

image.png

 

Porygon-Z

image.png

 

Feraligatr

image.png

 

Hitmonchan

image.png

 

Porygon2

image.png

 

Tauros

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Hariyama

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Kingler

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Rampardos

image.png

 

 

 

Thick Fat (sebo)

Drought (sequía) 

Drizzle (llovizna)

Rain dish (cura lluvia)

Chlorophyll (clorofila)

Adaptability

(adaptable)

Mamoswine

image.png

Ninetales

image.png

Politoad

image.png

Tentacruel

image.png.b3f0c955ff10ac783b8f4c82c8b723cc.png

Venusaur

image.png

Crawdaunt

image.png

Lightning rod (pararrayos)

Sap Sipper (herbívoro)

Harvest (cosecha)

Unburden (liviano)

Speed boost (impulso)

Contrary (respondón)

Raichu

image.png

Azumarill

image.png

Exeggutor

image.png

Sceptile

image.png

Blaziken

image.png

Serperior

image.png

Pachirisu

image.png

Miltank

image.png

 

Hitmonlee

image.png

 

 

Moody (veleta)

Shadowtag (sombra trampa)

Frisk (cacheo)

Poison Heal (antídoto)

Infiltrator (allanamiento)

Unaware (ignorante)

Glalie

image.png

Gothitelle

image.png

Dusclops

image.png

Gliscor

image.png

Chandelure

image.png

Clefable

image.png

Smeargle

image.png

 

 

 

Crobat

image.png

Quagsire

image.png

Solar Power (poder solar)

Skill link (encadenado)

Reckless (audaz)

Friend guard (compiescolta)

Gluttony (gula)

Defiant (competitivo)

Charizard

image.png

Ambipom

image.png

Staraptor

image.png

Clefairy

image.png

Snorlax

image.png

Braviary

image.png

 

Cinccino

image.png

Rhyperior

image.png

 

 

Empoleon

image.png

Water Absorb (absorbe agua)

No guard (indefenso)

Inner focus (foco interno)

Zen mode (modo daruma)

Guts (agallas)

Scrappy (intrépido)

Seismitoad

image.png

Golurk

image.png

Kangashkan

image.png

Darmanitan

image.png

Luxray

image.png

Exploud

image.png

Lanturn

image.png

 

 

 

 

Stoutland

image.png

Cacturne

image.png

 

 

 

 

 

Clear body (cuerpo puro)

Storm drain (colector)

Intimidate (intimidación)

Imposter (impostor)

 

 

Klinklang

image.png

Cradily

image.png

Scrafty

image.png

Ditto

image.png.0ec3db8d88d1d3061cc8120ef083e8f5.png

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


 

 

will coment about some things:

1st - Garchomp: Their Hidden ability probablly will not be added. The only thing that don't make Garchomp Ubers is the fact of don't have a decent ability. He have the higher usage on OU, a little far from 2nd most used. Is extremelly powerful, and earning Rough Skin will only make for Physical Attackers more harder to kill him. 
2nd - Ditto probablly will keep on Untiered. No reason to Grow it up, he is perfectly health for any metagaming that he are. 
3rd - Darmanitan Zen Mode is a joke. Their wallbreak set will keep the best set.
4th - Espeon with Magic Bounce will certain be used at least on Over Used. One of best abilitys , especially for stall teams(Reflecting Taunt and other Status moves, e. g. Entry hazards) and for Hyper Offense - (Acting as a Lead, preventing opponent from set up hazards while you set up Reflect & Light Screen, Espeon can carry both.), and Xatu also gets on the same ship. A little worse, comparing to Espeon, but can be useful on NU or UU
5th - Ninetales OU, will give more options to Sun teams. Politoed gets drizzle, so Sand and Hail no longer will be the only two weathers with double inducers(Hail can be summoned by Vaniluxe and Abomasnow, Sandstorm can be set by Tytar and hippo)
6th - Riolu prankster will not be too powerful here. Some of their important moves, like Coaching, he will not get acess.
7th - Thankfully they nerfed the KR Multi-Hit infinityflinch mechanic. Because if Ambipon and Cinccino gets Skill Link before change... 3 KR abusers on OU, they probablly banish those mons unti resolve the problem.

Edited by caioxlive13
Link to comment
20 hours ago, caioxlive13 said:


 

 

will coment about some things:

1st - Garchomp: Their Hidden ability probablly will not be added. The only thing that don't make Garchomp Ubers is the fact of don't have a decent ability. He have the higher usage on OU, a little far from 2nd most used. Is extremelly powerful, and earning Rough Skin will only make for Physical Attackers more harder to kill him. 
2nd - Ditto probablly will keep on Untiered. No reason to Grow it up, he is perfectly health for any metagaming that he are. 
3rd - Darmanitan Zen Mode is a joke. Their wallbreak set will keep the best set.
4th - Espeon with Magic Bounce will certain be used at least on Over Used. One of best abilitys , especially for stall teams(Reflecting Taunt and other Status moves, e. g. Entry hazards) and for Hyper Offense - (Acting as a Lead, preventing opponent from set up hazards while you set up Reflect & Light Screen, Espeon can carry both.), and Xatu also gets on the same ship. A little worse, comparing to Espeon, but can be useful on NU or UU
5th - Ninetales OU, will give more options to Sun teams. Politoed gets drizzle, so Sand and Hail no longer will be the only two weathers with double inducers(Hail can be summoned by Vaniluxe and Abomasnow, Sandstorm can be set by Tytar and hippo)
6th - Riolu prankster will not be too powerful here. Some of their important moves, like Coaching, he will not get acess.
7th - Thankfully they nerfed the KR Multi-Hit infinityflinch mechanic. Because if Ambipon and Cinccino gets Skill Link before change... 3 KR abusers on OU, they probablly banish those mons unti resolve the problem.

1.  i can't find any problem to rough skin garchomp 

2. Impostor ditto screws up any boosted mon. (Just imagine a +6 boosted gyarados, then a choice scarf +6 atk +6speed ditto appears to sweep you) also conditionates your opponent to not boost.

7- bruh

Edited by clayclover
Link to comment
On 6/16/2022 at 9:01 PM, clayclover said:

1.  i can't find any problem to rough skin garchomp 

2. Impostor ditto screws up any boosted mon. (Just imagine a +6 boosted gyarados, then a choice scarf +6 atk +6speed ditto appears to sweep you) also conditionates your opponent to not boost.
 

1 - Garchomp already are extremelly powerful on OU metagaming, but he don't get banished again because of your weaker point: Lack of a decent ability. If added Rough Skin, then he will get a decent ability and will end with your only weaker point 

2 - Ditto will be the same case that he pass on showdown. Are on lowest tier possible, but are decent for all tiers above(Including AG & Ubers)

Link to comment
On 6/16/2022 at 12:07 AM, caioxlive13 said:

1st - Garchomp: Their Hidden ability probablly will not be added. The only thing that don't make Garchomp Ubers is the fact of don't have a decent ability. He have the higher usage on OU, a little far from 2nd most used. Is extremelly powerful, and earning Rough Skin will only make for Physical Attackers more harder to kill him. 
 

I just couldn't disagree more with this, Garchomp isn't Uber because they took sd away from him, and with this, the number of checks and counters are no longer limited to Weavile, Cloyster, Mandibuzz and possibly Umbreon, I agree that Rought Skin is a better ability than Sand Veil that is only relevant when you have luck on your side, however, I see it as an exaggeration to say that Rought Skin enhances Garchomp to the point of making it Uber, it will only be a Recoil generator for users of contact movements, outside other than that, it stays the same.

 

On 6/11/2022 at 3:24 AM, DiosSlurpuff said:

I doubt that Xatu will have a significant role in OU, I would say that at best he could be the ''Espeon of UU''

Regarding this, I must retract, I still maintain that it can be left in UU due to its use, but I noticed that Xatu U-Turn puts together a very good core with Dugtrio, so I consider it viable within OU

 

 

 

Possibly Chandelure Infiltrator + Choice Scarf is the safest check against Gengar, Chandelure, Breloom and other setup sweepers that use subs (Except Hydreigon)

 

I also think that as in BW and some later gens, Staraptor will be BL UU, therefore, it would go to OU.

 

 

 

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On 6/15/2022 at 10:07 PM, caioxlive13 said:


 

 

will coment about some things:

1st - Garchomp: Their Hidden ability probablly will not be added. The only thing that don't make Garchomp Ubers is the fact of don't have a decent ability. He have the higher usage on OU, a little far from 2nd most used. Is extremelly powerful, and earning Rough Skin will only make for Physical Attackers more harder to kill him. 
 

I would prefer 12% recoil damage as long as I make sure I can land the ice punch without having to pray when sand is active.

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18 hours ago, DiosSlurpuff said:

I just couldn't disagree more with this, Garchomp isn't Uber because they took sd away from him, and with this, the number of checks and counters are no longer limited to Weavile, Cloyster, Mandibuzz and possibly Umbreon, I agree that Rought Skin is a better ability than Sand Veil that is only relevant when you have luck on your side, however, I see it as an exaggeration to say that Rought Skin enhances Garchomp to the point of making it Uber, it will only be a Recoil generator for users of contact movements, outside other than that, it stays the same.

Just the fact of the Recoil can affect a lot of some natural checks of him, especially the ones that attack with contact moves(Ex: Conkeldurr Ice punch, he can take 16,67%, if chomp don't have rocky helmet too, otherwise is 33,33%. He already take considerable damage, and if use the Close Combat set, he cannot heal, making for the ones that uses this sets worse to deal with chomp if don't have other mons that give superefective damage, or the ones that can do this, is already fainted. So, one of their bets sets today, will be obsollete or a 2nd/3rd option of set, just because of one pokemon that are present on almost 50% of teams). 

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1 hour ago, caioxlive13 said:

Just the fact of the Recoil can affect a lot of some natural checks of him

Yeah, checks like conkeldurr, Gyarados, and... That's it.

I really don't see why make such a fuss over a 12% recoil hab, there's still Weavile, Cloyster, p2, etc, etc, etc.

And as for Rocky Helmet, this would take away power by not having Life Orb or the possibility of recovering from Leftovers, so I still don't see why you think it would be Uber or that there is even a minimal reason to remove Rought Skin, it has already been shown as well that Sand Veil can completely decide the course of some duels that Rought Skin never could, no matter how low the odds.

1 hour ago, caioxlive13 said:

So, one of their bets sets today, will be obsollete or a 2nd/3rd option of set, just because of one pokemon that are present on almost 50% of teams

Let me see if I understood correctly, are you complaining because there will be a meta change? because it is exactly what you are looking for with the hidden abilities lol

Edited by DiosSlurpuff
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1 hour ago, DiosSlurpuff said:

Yeah, checks like conkeldurr, Gyarados, and... That's it.

I really don't see why make such a fuss over a 12% recoil hab, there's still Weavile, Cloyster, p2, etc, etc, etc.

And as for Rocky Helmet, this would take away power by not having Life Orb or the possibility of recovering from Leftovers, so I still don't see why you think it would be Uber or that there is even a minimal reason to remove Rought Skin, it has already been shown as well that Sand Veil can completely decide the course of some duels that Rought Skin never could, no matter how low the odds.

However, still are a Free Rocky Helmet without you spend your moveslot, allowing you to still use leftovers, life orb, or something else. 

About the checks, Gyarados are a little irrelevant, because he have usage, iirc, beetween 8-15%. However, conkeldurr is one of most used, iirc 2nd Fighting-Type most used, behind Mienshao, i don't checked usage this month but i'm basing on the other months that i've seen. This can be a massive hit against him, because he will be forced to use the Drain Punch set, to recover part of damage that he will take Vs a Garchomp, Rocky helmet or not, making the set more predictable.

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1 hour ago, caioxlive13 said:

However, still are a Free Rocky Helmet without you spend your moveslot, allowing you to still use leftovers, life orb, or something else. 

Under this strange logic, Ferrothorn (which is one of the 6 most used), should also lack ability, since it is a free Rocky Helmet that allows you to use Shed Shell and cancel Magnet Pull from Magnezone, Leftovers or some other item... which doesn't make sense xD.

So I'd like you to give me a real reason why Garchomp Rought Skin is so broken to the point of deactivating his ha.

1 hour ago, caioxlive13 said:

his can be a massive hit against him, because he will be forced to use the Drain Punch set

That set is used in a huge difference from the CC set, and it's not like CC Conkeldurr would become unviable either, you'd just have to use a Wishpasser or some other mon to stop Garchomp, and there are quite a few options really.

 

 

Sincerely, I would like to continue focusing on the topic of the thread, we are already rambling too much, a separate thread about garchomp rought skin can be opened.

Edited by DiosSlurpuff
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