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Optimal Spinda [Useful for Alphas]


DragoTamer

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@DragoTamerNice idea but i will have to add to this i use a variance that is more tank because sometimes i get outspeed, in terms of speed Spinda kinda sucks for example against a fairly recent Alpha poke Salamence, he gets outspeed Vs. 252 31speed Salamence,(this happened on the first time alpha Salamence appeared a long time ago) i don't know if it's a bug of alpha or they have EV trained then they reset... I've also experienced one alpha using a heal move with heal block used on him, yes I've used first the move then him and he manages to use it wish.....
It's a lot of speed with jolly+evtrained+31IV on Speed.
I've used better the first Pokémon and switching safely the Pokémon its specially good vs alphas that uses moves that debuffs them making them buff like Superpower.... in such way that i use him very tank like  31xHP and 252HP 31xDef and 252Def but is possible to remove some for more Sp. Def. but then i can use the rest of the turn to proc the Alpha buff mechanic and make him sleep with Hypnosis, with some luck, i can snowball making Spinda unkillable and i can keep debuffing him... Also i don't need to pay a fee to survive (focus sash strat) the alpha because he can survive a Superpower Crit in this setup, a more versatile approach also "Bad Luck Protecting" me which can happen xD. Of course depends the other pokes of the "catching comp" too.
@LiIith You can use scarf too is a lot of speed, so if you are only looking for skill swap in a long term is more cheap then using focus sash atm is 1,250 one unit, if you have a scarf which you are not using or you have one alpha catch team for more chars is really more cheap (and lazy if is that's why you are not EV training/breeding your Spinda) its like 110~ alphas will pay a scarf which you will used for other purposes also if you are catching with 3 chars that cuts to 36~ a single month of costs of Focus sash is already paying the scarf and the scarf you can use for other purposes...
210 is the speed of a debuff speed nature with scarf which is pretty good can outspeed a lot of things jumps to 236 with a nature that doesnt debuff speed in the Salamence scenario that is ev trained+31IV on speed the Spinda can outspeed the Salamence.... So you can see is really worth in terms of cost and efficiency also is one click to setup instead of keep buying and keep equipping focus sash every time looking in term of laziness.... But how you play is not wrong maybe you don't catch almost any alphas or only a few so is ok also sometimes is hard to remove a habit or a change how its done things because is already working right? but have their problems in terms of money and laziness(?) i guess...
Anyway if you manage to read all of this thx for your attention :D!

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10 hours ago, sireddz said:

@DragoTamerNice idea but i will have to add to this i use a variance that is more tank because sometimes i get outspeed, in terms of speed Spinda kinda sucks for example against a fairly recent Alpha poke Salamence, he gets outspeed Vs. 252 31speed Salamence,(this happened on the first time alpha Salamence appeared a long time ago) i don't know if it's a bug of alpha or they have EV trained then they reset... I've also experienced one alpha using a heal move with heal block used on him, yes I've used first the move then him and he manages to use it wish.....
It's a lot of speed with jolly+evtrained+31IV on Speed.
I've used better the first Pokémon and switching safely the Pokémon its specially good vs alphas that uses moves that debuffs them making them buff like Superpower.... in such way that i use him very tank like  31xHP and 252HP 31xDef and 252Def but is possible to remove some for more Sp. Def. but then i can use the rest of the turn to proc the Alpha buff mechanic and make him sleep with Hypnosis, with some luck, i can snowball making Spinda unkillable and i can keep debuffing him... Also i don't need to pay a fee to survive (focus sash strat) the alpha because he can survive a Superpower Crit in this setup, a more versatile approach also "Bad Luck Protecting" me which can happen xD. Of course depends the other pokes of the "catching comp" too.
@LiIith You can use scarf too is a lot of speed, so if you are only looking for skill swap in a long term is more cheap then using focus sash atm is 1,250 one unit, if you have a scarf which you are not using or you have one alpha catch team for more chars is really more cheap (and lazy if is that's why you are not EV training/breeding your Spinda) its like 110~ alphas will pay a scarf which you will used for other purposes also if you are catching with 3 chars that cuts to 36~ a single month of costs of Focus sash is already paying the scarf and the scarf you can use for other purposes...
210 is the speed of a debuff speed nature with scarf which is pretty good can outspeed a lot of things jumps to 236 with a nature that doesnt debuff speed in the Salamence scenario that is ev trained+31IV on speed the Spinda can outspeed the Salamence.... So you can see is really worth in terms of cost and efficiency also is one click to setup instead of keep buying and keep equipping focus sash every time looking in term of laziness.... But how you play is not wrong maybe you don't catch almost any alphas or only a few so is ok also sometimes is hard to remove a habit or a change how its done things because is already working right? but have their problems in terms of money and laziness(?) i guess...
Anyway if you manage to read all of this thx for your attention :D!

hey thats a really good idea, haha but i already leveled my spinda to 100 with exp candys, nwn, ty anyways

 

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On 2/14/2023 at 9:22 AM, sireddz said:

@DragoTamerNice idea but i will have to add to this i use a variance that is more tank because sometimes i get outspeed, in terms of speed Spinda kinda sucks for example against a fairly recent Alpha poke Salamence, he gets outspeed Vs. 252 31speed Salamence,(this happened on the first time alpha Salamence appeared a long time ago) i don't know if it's a bug of alpha or they have EV trained then they reset... I've also experienced one alpha using a heal move with heal block used on him, yes I've used first the move then him and he manages to use it wish.....
It's a lot of speed with jolly+evtrained+31IV on Speed.
 

Thanks for your feedback! Alpha Salamence outsped you most likely because your speed wasn't fast enough. That's why I recommend a bare minimum of Jolly nature, 31 IV speed, with 236 speed EVs and then you can max out HP EVs and put the rest into Defense. I personally use the Spinda I have listed in the optimal build above and it tanks several hits and always outspeeds alphas. For every IV reduction in speed, you can raise your speed EVs by 4. This means if you choose to max EV Spinda's speed to 252, Your IV speed has to be at least 27. I guarantee you'll have a relatively strong spinda that will do very well in alphas following the optimal build. It also isn't a pokemon that is meant to stay in battle for very long given its relatively low base defense and special defense stats. Regardless, I highly recommending ensuring Spinda can outspeed with the layout I gave so you can skill swap on turn 1, stay in battle, protect if you so choose, then throw a poke ball for that guaranteed first time contrary activation and it works perfectly.

 

 

Having said this, you can choose to build spinda however you like as it fits with the team you use to catch alphas. The focus sash strategy, if you don't want to breed a spinda and use a fresh one from GTL, works as well.

Edited by DragoTamer
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13 hours ago, Veronica said:

I have all the ocarinas, what should be the moveset for Spinda? I also passed the 4 egg moves.

Hey! there are a few options. Fake out is nice for Dragonite multiscale. Wish is great is you plan to send in the pokemn and want to give HP back if you're swapping into a damage move. sunny and rain dance are options if you want to reduce the damage of certain move types for a few turns. guard split may be a good idea to reduce the defense and special defense of the alphas without stat drops that could be reversed.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Love the guide, without knowing about the existence of it i made my own, but i was wondering what's the ev distribution, so this is perfect, thank you so much ❤️ 

i used mine with trick / lagging tail - skill swap - disable - encore 

it even perform at level 1, the first day i tried it xD

nvm while i was typing this i realize that my set doesn't really care about Spd, lagging tail will always make me go 2nd ( so i should invest in def- sp def ) and once the alpha is holding the lagging tail i will always attack first anyways, regardless of the stats or stats changes that the alpha may have. 

anyways thank you so much for the guide :3 

Edited by MaxiNyaNya
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On 11/22/2023 at 12:12 PM, MaxiNyaNya said:

Love the guide, without knowing about the existence of it i made my own, but i was wondering what's the ev distribution, so this is perfect, thank you so much ❤️ 

i used mine with trick / lagging tail - skill swap - disable - encore 

it even perform at level 1, the first day i tried it xD

nvm while i was typing this i realize that my set doesn't really care about Spd, lagging tail will always make me go 2nd ( so i should invest in def- sp def ) and once the alpha is holding the lagging tail i will always attack first anyways, regardless of the stats or stats changes that the alpha may have. 

anyways thank you so much for the guide :3 

Thanks for your kind words!

 

Lagging tail is indeed a viable strategy and while investing in defense is nice, you still miss out on the other stat. I explained some of the shortcomings for the lagging tail strategy in the spoilers section for Usage at the top. I can copy them below though for easier viewing

 

  • By having a Jolly spinda with a 31 IV in speed and 236 speed EVs, you are no longer stuck to use choice scarf, choice band, choice specs, lagging tail, and focus sash. It will also tank hits so you can another item as you see fit.
     
  • A spinda with this build will also outspeed alpha Electrode even if it's level 72 with a speed boosted nature and a 31 for its Speed IV
     
  • Another benefit to outspeeding and tanking hits (except a STAB move from alpha Slaking, but you have protect for that), is that you can skill swap before an alpha pokemon uses a stat boosting move such as swords dance, calm mind, etc. With lagging tail, the opposing alpha pokemon can use swords dance for +2 for example or arbok could use glare. Alphas nowadays have several moves that could hurt the lagging tail strategy
     
  • This build is especially useful when battling alpha Dragonite. You can skill swap immediately, throw a poke ball to activate contrary, and if spinda is still in, you can get chip damage or continue to poke ball. Spinda isn't so bulky that it will taste turns while it's in, but isn't so fragile that it'll faint right away. When you're at -1 at least, you can swap to a pokemon to soak Dragonite to remove STAB (except for aqua tail now) and then switcheroo with assault vest to have Dragonite avoid using rest. You can then use Breloom as a catcher. STAB aqua tail won't do much to Breloom and toxic heal + spore will help it keep up with any damage received.
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i don't really agree with that, investing in tankyness (HP- Def -Sp Def / natured ) allows you to resist pretty much any hit that is not critical. ( my spinda still haven't die yet from any move so far, eventually it will happen and i'll edit this ) 

So basically if you are running lagging tail the only hit that matters is the first one, as long as you survive the first hit you can lock the opposite monster, i have been using my set a lot lately and it works incredible well. 

Turn 1 you take the hit and trick into lagging tail, now the alpha is holding lagging tail, this works as a secure for speed, no matter what, it will always hit second, so you don't really care if he boots its stats even after the contrary effect get reversed. 

Turn 2 you will be faster than the alpha ( cause is holding lagging tail ) so you can freely skill swap and lock it. 

if the alpha does a move like SS, DD, or any other boost stat move or support move you can Encore it ( cause it will be holding the lagging tail ), so after the encore you can skillswap disable for some damage before going back to your breloom/smeargle/parasect or any other spore/soak user according to the situation. 


i think this set is super optimal for ppl that doesn't run rock smash, flash or strengh on their Spinda. 


 

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12 hours ago, MaxiNyaNya said:

i don't really agree with that, investing in tankyness (HP- Def -Sp Def / natured ) allows you to resist pretty much any hit that is not critical. ( my spinda still haven't die yet from any move so far, eventually it will happen and i'll edit this ) 

So basically if you are running lagging tail the only hit that matters is the first one, as long as you survive the first hit you can lock the opposite monster, i have been using my set a lot lately and it works incredible well. 

Turn 1 you take the hit and trick into lagging tail, now the alpha is holding lagging tail, this works as a secure for speed, no matter what, it will always hit second, so you don't really care if he boots its stats even after the contrary effect get reversed. 

Turn 2 you will be faster than the alpha ( cause is holding lagging tail ) so you can freely skill swap and lock it. 

if the alpha does a move like SS, DD, or any other boost stat move or support move you can Encore it ( cause it will be holding the lagging tail ), so after the encore you can skillswap disable for some damage before going back to your breloom/smeargle/parasect or any other spore/soak user according to the situation. 


i think this set is super optimal for ppl that doesn't run rock smash, flash or strengh on their Spinda. 


 

I appreciate you explaining more of your strat!

 

The spinda I mentioned above can also tank all the applicable hits and it lasts long enough to also toss that first poke ball which allows for stat drops. It's convenient in that you can switch when needed, but also focus on letting it faint to toss in your next poke. The issue with switching it out mid battle is that often time some pokemon is going to take a hit. Also locking it into a move isn't always going to be ideal. Arbok with glare, alphas that use swagger, or moves that have 5 PP or less aren't as practical to lock a move onto. Of course I agree that you can use your strategy and find some way around it, but it does need a lot more exceptions to use it than the Spinda I listed at the beginning. Additionally if you fail to catch the alpha in enough turns, you'll have to reset lagging tail on the alpha if it runs out of PP. If the alpha happens to have self-recovery moves and you remove lagging tail, you risk it recovering its HP, getting paralyzed, etc. Additionally the set mentioned at the beginning of this guide has rock smash or strength on Spinda, strength being a STAB move. There's a red note I included that said if you have the ocarinas, you can use other moves as well. Jolly Spinda can also use the trick and focus sash strategy for alphas that don't have recovery moves to take the alpha down to 1 HP if needed and can pair with protect to turn stall for timer ball turns. To be clear though, your strategy does work and it's ultimately up to user preference, but it does have more shortcomings than a Jolly Spinda with 31 in its speed IV

Edited by DragoTamer
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