fredrichnietze Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) You're stupid and don't understand how God Hand works at all. Cu Chulainn has no way of beating Hercules, for several reasons, and they're all God Hand 1. God Hand nullifies all attacks that are lower than A Rank. This means that all of Lancer's normal attacks will be nullified, because his strength stat is lower than A. 2. God Hand provides Heracles with an immunity to something once it deals damage to him (note: It has to deal damage). 3. Heracles has to be killed 12 times. Cu cannot kill him 12 times with just Gae Bolg, even if you consider the thrown version a different Noble Phantasm. At most he can kill him twice, and then loses because he can't hurt him anymore In addition, modern weaponry such as guns have no effect on Servants. The only time they do is when Lancelot turns them into D Rank Noble Phantasms, which are a world of a difference. Please stop talking about things you don't understand you giant secondary. edit: and no, even with Runes, he wouldn't fucking win. Not enough of his different runes can allow him to kill Heracles 12 times. The only reason Saber can do it is because she literally kills him 12 times instantly because Excalibur is fucking stupid. The only way you're ever going to see him win is if he's fighting a heavily nerfed version of Herc. Turn off your Lancer uguu. http://typemoon.wikia.com/wiki/God_Handsays "oh look lancer's attacks can break through god hand" and later, "powerful attacks can take more then one life". not just sabers. apparently their is a set limit to how much hp a life has then anything past that does multiple lives worth. according to illiya, if rin uses 5 times as many jewels as it takes to take one of his lives, it would take 6 lives. since lancer can modify his attacks with runes to use more power, and if he knew how beserkers power worked, he could do multiple lives worth of damage all at once. how many? it's impossible to know. maybe enough maybe not. the easy way ofc is dont take herk on when hes at full strength to be sure, but the point is it's possible 2 modified strikes from his lances could do it. anyways can we talk like civilized beings and not resort to insults? edit king me Edited April 25, 2016 by fredrichnietze ShadowGary 1
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 http://typemoon.wikia.com/wiki/God_Handsays "oh look lancer's attacks can break through god hand" and later, "powerful attacks can take more then one life". not just sabers. apparently their is a set limit to how much hp a life has then anything past that does multiple lives worth. according to illiya, if rin uses 5 times as many jewels as it takes to take one of his lives, it would take 6 lives. since lancer can modify his attacks with runes to use more power, and if he knew how beserkers power worked, he could do multiple lives worth of damage all at once. how many? it's impossible to know. maybe enough maybe not. the easy way ofc is dont take herk on when hes at full strength to be sure, but the point is it's possible 2 modified strikes from his lances could do it. anyways can we talk like civilized beings and not resort to insults? edit king me Even with runes he still could not, Gae Bolg with rune buffs will take 1 life and then Herc will gain immunity to it. The Gae Bolg that pierces the heart is NOT that powerful when it misses, otherwise Saber wouldn't even have fucking survived despite dodging the lethal blow. Upgrading it by 1 rank doesn't turn it into Excalibur. If you count the thrown weapon as a different Noble Phantasm then the sheer explosive force of it could potentially take several lives but not enough to win. If something like that could kill Herc 12 times Archer wouldn't be standing after taking it, Rho Aias or not. Also even if he kills Herc with regular attacks, he will only be able to do so once. Hercules is a ridiculously broken servant that even the author has gone on record saying he thinks it's really stupid and overpowered. If you try and tell me an A rank regular attack can take more than 1 life then you're just completely wrong. It shouldn't even kill him once,and even if it does he gains resistance to it right after. Cu literally DOES NOT have enough tools, nor the right ones to fight and defeat Herc and in the setting of Fate/Stay Night, the only characters who are even capable of beating him are Saber, Gilgamesh, Sakura(maybe) and Saber Alter.
Heimann Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Just started black Butler dubbed. These voices are making me laugh so hard.
Rigamorty Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Don't both of the animes go on about how Sabre is the most powerful of the melee class servants?
fredrichnietze Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Even with runes he still could not, Gae Bolg with rune buffs will take 1 life and then Herc will gain immunity to it. The Gae Bolg that pierces the heart is NOT that powerful when it misses, otherwise Saber wouldn't even have fucking survived despite dodging the lethal blow. Upgrading it by 1 rank doesn't turn it into Excalibur. If you count the thrown weapon as a different Noble Phantasm then the sheer explosive force of it could potentially take several lives but not enough to win. If something like that could kill Herc 12 times Archer wouldn't be standing after taking it, Rho Aias or not. Also even if he kills Herc with regular attacks, he will only be able to do so once. Hercules is a ridiculously broken servant that even the author has gone on record saying he thinks it's really stupid and overpowered. If you try and tell me an A rank regular attack can take more than 1 life then you're just completely wrong. It shouldn't even kill him once,and even if it does he gains resistance to it right after. Cu literally DOES NOT have enough tools, nor the right ones to fight and defeat Herc and in the setting of Fate/Stay Night, the only characters who are even capable of beating him are Saber, Gilgamesh, Sakura(maybe) and Saber Alter. your entire argument is based off the speculation of saber which is never confirmed in the books or show. what is confirmed is rin who is human and weaker then a hero which is stated at the very beginning of the show can take out around half of Hercules lives with a single attack, albeit using literally everything she has into one blow. and where is the source material of "no mortal weapon can damage heroes?" i dont recall this from the show? Don't both of the animes go on about how Sabre is the most powerful of the melee class servants? both animes more often then not do not have straight 1v1 fair battles, but have multiple fights going on and the servants trying to protect their masters or fight 2 or more at a time. further more the power of the servant is partially dependent on the master, as well their commitment to the cause. most non beserker class do not go all out in every fight.
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Don't both of the animes go on about how Sabre is the most powerful of the melee class servants? Sabers are hailed as the strongest of the 3 Knight classes (Lancer Saber and Archer) but it doesn't necessarily mean the Saber you summon will be stronger than the Lancer or Archer summoned. Unless you have a Catalyst to summon Arturia then there are few servants who could match her. For Lancers, I think Romulus would be very powerful in a Grail War and could potentially match Arturia. Karna is also strong as fuck and basically Gilgamesh tier. Pic related it's our lord and savior Romulus [spoiler][/spoiler] Additionally, Grand classes now exist as of Fate/Grand Order. The only one we know of is Solomon, King of Magic and Grand Caster. The Caster of Casters. We don't know who the other Grand servants are yet, but they're without a doubt the most powerful of their class. Solomon is so strong, he can summon himself from the Throne of Heroes to whatever time period he wants. I'm honestly really hoping they don't cop out and make Arturia the Grand Saber because when you show off Solomon like that how can she even compare? The dude oneshot three powerful servants at once.
Rigamorty Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 your entire argument is based off the speculation of saber which is never confirmed in the books or show. what is confirmed is rin who is human and weaker then a hero which is stated at the very beginning of the show can take out around half of Hercules lives with a single attack, albeit using literally everything she has into one blow. and where is the source material of "no mortal weapon can damage heroes?" i dont recall this from the show? both animes more often then not do not have straight 1v1 fair battles, but have multiple fights going on and the servants trying to protect their masters or fight 2 or more at a time. further more the power of the servant is partially dependent on the master, as well their commitment to the cause. most non beserker class do not go all out in every fight. I'm not talking about when their actual fights happen, but just like before they're summoning or during the summoning they talk about how they want to summon Sabre because it's the most powerful melee servant.
Instagramlol Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Just started black Butler dubbed. These voices are making me laugh so hard. how is it? i might watch it as well Heimann 1
Heimann Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) On episode 4 , very interested so far. However after episode 4, no more dubs exsist. Edited April 25, 2016 by Heimann
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) your entire argument is based off the speculation of saber which is never confirmed in the books or show. what is confirmed is rin who is human and weaker then a hero which is stated at the very beginning of the show can take out around half of Hercules lives with a single attack, albeit using literally everything she has into one blow. and where is the source material of "no mortal weapon can damage heroes?" i dont recall this from the show? both animes more often then not do not have straight 1v1 fair battles, but have multiple fights going on and the servants trying to protect their masters or fight 2 or more at a time. further more the power of the servant is partially dependent on the master, as well their commitment to the cause. most non beserker class do not go all out in every fight. Servants are spirits, you can't shoot a fucking Servant and deal damage to it. Modern weaponry cannot harm a Servant. You're citing the fucking anime which contains no information, and you're bringing up books, like what have you even read? Have you ever touched the visual novel? It doesn't sound like it. Also what speculation? With Shirou as her master, she has C rank endurance compared to Heracles' A. In the Fate series, a difference of C to A is EXTREMELY huge, and EVEN with Rin as her master, she has B rank endurance. Are you going to tell me a Gae Bolg buffed only 1 rank, when the previous Gae Bolg couldn't kill Saber, would even come CLOSE to taking even half of Herc's lives? Not to mention this shit with Rin is literally just you citing the wiki and it doesn't even say she will definitely take 6 lives. Here let me quote the wiki for you since you're so fond of it. "Illya comments that Rin utilizing five times the jewels required to take one life may have been able to take all six lives" Not even 100%. In addition, when I was referring to regular attacks I was not referring to modern weapons like guns, I was referring to literally Cu attacking Hercules with his weapon. He can only kill him with that once(he becomes immune to it regardless if it dealt damage or not), Gae Bolg once and thrown Gae Bolg isn't strong enough to take 10 lives. If you have anything else to say I'd be glad to hear it, maybe next you'll tell me he'll kill him 10 times with his honor because honor can't lose. Edited April 25, 2016 by Gilgamesh
fredrichnietze Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) I'm not talking about when their actual fights happen, but just like before they're summoning or during the summoning they talk about how they want to summon Sabre because it's the most powerful melee servant. early on several people refer to her as "the" most powerful, then they almost immediately contradict. it's possible the person/s saying this may be ignorant of all the stronger ones, or it may just be because of her crazy noble phantasm which is horribly overpowered. EDIT @gilga i have read very little of the books and watched the anime. yes im quoting the wiki. and? going to ignore the personal attacks and incredulity and go to your actual point. correct me if im wrong but you are saying that Hercules becoming immune to attacks that he has previously died form makes him immune to all weapons because he has presumably been attacked by all weapons before in the past? because many weapons like guass guns, artillery, nukes, ect exist today that have not existed in Hercules life time nor in previous wars. or is there some other mention of heroes being immune to weapons that i havent heard of? also srs whats with the hostility? did i kill you cat or something? can i not state my opinion on a forums about a fictional universe without offending you? i enjoy civil discourse and dissent is the foundation of democracy but i dont talk to you if you are just going to insult me with every other word. Edited April 25, 2016 by fredrichnietze
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 early on several people refer to her as "the" most powerful, then they almost immediately contradict. it's possible the person/s saying this may be ignorant of all the stronger ones, or it may just be because of her crazy noble phantasm which is horribly overpowered. EDIT @gilga i have read very little of the books and watched the anime. yes im quoting the wiki. and? going to ignore the personal attacks and incredulity and go to your actual point. correct me if im wrong but you are saying that Hercules becoming immune to attacks that he has previously died form makes him immune to all weapons because he has presumably been attacked by all weapons before in the past? because many weapons like guass guns, artillery, nukes, ect exist today that have not existed in Hercules life time nor in previous wars. or is there some other mention of heroes being immune to weapons that i havent heard of? also srs whats with the hostility? did i kill you cat or something? can i not state my opinion on a forums about a fictional universe without offending you? i enjoy civil discourse and dissent is the foundation of democracy but i dont talk to you if you are just going to insult me with every other word. I'll go ahead and quote the wiki for you again From the Battle section of the Servants page: "When describing their strength, they can be likened to a single jet fighter in pure attack power, far beyond the ability for a single person to fight. While strong, they would have to refuel many times in order to destroy a city. Though there are many modern weapons that are more powerful, their status as spiritual bodies makes them among the most powerful due to being immune to modern weapons." So basically what I'm saying is, even if Chu Culainn could pick up a gun and shoot it, it wouldn't deal damage. Nothing in the modern world can hurt a Servant, unless it is being used by Lancelot, because Lancelot turns modern weapons into magical weapons that are capable of harming Servants. That's irrelevant though, because I was talking about Cu using his weapon, Gae Bolg, to strike Hercules normally. When Cu attacks Hercules even once, the wound will heal and Hercules will no longer take damage from Gae Bolg's normal strikes. He will still take damage from Gae Bolg, but again, if it even kills him, which it might not because he has a very high luck stat like Saber and Cu has E Rank Luck, it'll only kill him once, and then he becomes immune to that too. At this point, he would have 10-12 lives left, and thrown Gae Bolg wouldn't be strong enough to take out his remaining lives due to his extremely high Endurance stat. There's also the fact that he's fighting him at the same time as all this. fredrichnietze 1
Rigamorty Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Gilgamesh still taunts me with that Guess That Pokemon winner sig
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) Gilgamesh still taunts me with that Guess That Pokemon winner sig Fucking Girafarig edit: I actually just went through that thread again and it was so funny seeing everyone be like WOW WTF THIS HINT IS BULLSHIT FUCKING SCAMLEE and we're just like "dude 9 missing letters lmao" Edited April 25, 2016 by Gilgamesh
Rigamorty Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Fucking Girafarig edit: I actually just went through that thread again and it was so funny seeing everyone be like WOW WTF THIS HINT IS BULLSHIT FUCKING SCAMLEE and we're just like "dude 9 missing letters lmao" we both got it at practically the same time too, that was fucked up
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Reminder that Okita is the strongest Saber ;) I don't see a Grand in front of her name :^)
londark Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Just wait, i'll make her a grand saber....but real talk, considering the canon servants, who would be the strongest Saber? Sigfried?
King Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) Imagine actually thinking a servant with D rank or lower luck can do literally anything Edited April 25, 2016 by King
fredrichnietze Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 so scratch bomb idea. go back to hide until herk is down a few lives which isnt really lancers thing. damn.
Gilgamesh Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 Herc is just really unbalanced fam, the only reason he loses in any of the routes is because of Saber or Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh in particular being his perfect counter because he has countless different noble phantasms which basically ignore God Hand's immunity effect cause they're all different weapons, in addition to an anti-divine servant chain. Cu is a really strong lancer, much more so than Diarmuid, but Luck is a factor in this series for some reason and he's got none of it. He might have had a more real chance to win if his original master was still around, because she is strong and actually capable of 1v1ing servants that aren't Hercules, but if he distracted Herc long enough she would make quick work of Illya, no doubt.
King Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) Herc is just really unbalanced fam, the only reason he loses in any of the routes is because of Saber or Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh in particular being his perfect counter because he has countless different noble phantasms which basically ignore God Hand's immunity effect cause they're all different weapons, in addition to an anti-divine servant chain. Cu is a really strong lancer, much more so than Diarmuid, but Luck is a factor in this series for some reason and he's got none of it. He might have had a more real chance to win if his original master was still around, because she is strong and actually capable of 1v1ing servants that aren't Hercules, but if he distracted Herc long enough she would make quick work of Illya, no doubt.Spoiler this pls, a certain someone I know is still watching.[spoiler] Also yeah, Herc is ridiculous.Imagine making him a berserker with a homunculus master, now that would be stupid[/spoiler]Nevermind too late. Edited April 25, 2016 by King axx 1
Guest Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 (edited) Fred, I think it bothers people when you bring up a topic that others know a LOT about, make a statement and then act like you're most definitely correct. It's the body fat percentage thing all over again. Also in regards to "King me", please do not use my cutie's name like that. ALSO I AM NOT SCAMLEE. I just liked watching you all suffer. Edited April 25, 2016 by Emlee
Heimann Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 I have mixed emotions about the child in bb. Why does he look so feminine lol.
Guest Posted April 25, 2016 Posted April 25, 2016 I have mixed emotions about the child in bb. Why does he look so feminine lol. I haven't seen him but traps are a thing.
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