Update Discussion thread 27/2/18

[Bishav]

2 hours ago, RedDragonERa said:

I don't know why everyone is much angry. Dittos are still valuable for example if u need a comp metangross u need hunt beldums with 31 IV and everyone know that beldums are insanely rare and harder to catch. So I don't think everyone goes for perfect metangross and what about porygon  gonna buy porygon breeders using GC coins at high price. I'm sure that dittos always gonna be helpful side by hand. 

The higher end dittos(the ones with 4x,5x ivs)will have a drop in their past value as you can breed stuff now with 1-2x iv dittos. 

[ThePrettyPetard]

2 hours ago, Gunthug said:

Perhaps it's the fact that I'm removed from the short term consequences that allows me to see the long term benefits so clearly 

the thing that you don't understand is that pretty much everyone see that and we don't argue about it. you think only by logic using the game mechanic when other like me think about the human factor wich is a bit harder to understand for many but also harder to explain.

 

for the human factor i'll just explain it with my own way of seeing it. by disapointing someone that you said you would help you loose a bit of his trust and each time you disapoint him  i just get worse and worse if you get to a point where a person has no more trust in you that person can either quite you or turn on you if he is attached to something between you (maybe even both). this person that left probably got angry enough at you that he will spread the word of how bad you are and maybe even add some extra to make you look more bad becaus you pushed to much. when refering to this game people just start spreading hate toward the devs for their lack of care for us and this spread has a desease that will just make the next person more encline to leave quicker than it would normally have. so this also affect the community in the long run and not in a good way.

 

from my time i spent in the game talking with many different people i could see that people want to trust the devs to be good with us but sadly many are on the edge of giving up. this is only due to a lack of concern from the devs

 

also since i see that you missinterpreted this: 

10 hours ago, OrangeManiac said:

if you want people to play this game rather than Pokemon battle simulators - this is exactly what the administrations has to be careful with.

i'll give you a quick explanation. this meant that if the grind for pvp here gets too anoying people will just go away from pokemmo to go to that battle simulator aka another game.

 

last thing could you please @Gunthug stop and think a little more about what someone is trying to say, maybe read it a few time and don't stop thinking at the first sense you see because there can be more than one and you could just be getting the wrong one

[Gunthug]

6 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

the thing that you don't understand is that pretty much everyone see that and we don't argue about it. you think only by logic using the game mechanic when other like me think about the human factor wich is a bit harder to understand for many but also harder to explain.

I am 100% aware of the "human factor," my entire argument has been that the devs should not focus on this when doing so would essentially paralyze them from improving the game. You say "pretty much everyone sees" the long term benefits, and yet I spent the entire first half of this exact thread arguing against people who couldn't quite seem to grasp that (you, on the other hand, spent that time pitying them and trying to look sympathetic instead of actually addressing any of my counter points)

 

6 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

 

for the human factor i'll just explain it with my own way of seeing it. by disapointing someone that you said you would help you loose a bit of his trust and each time you disapoint him  i just get worse and worse if you get to a point where a person has no more trust in you that person can either quite you or turn on you if he is attached to something between you (maybe even both). this person that left probably got angry enough at you that he will spread the word of how bad you are and maybe even add some extra to make you look more bad becaus you pushed to much. when refering to this game people just start spreading hate toward the devs for their lack of care for us and this spread has a desease that will just make the next person more encline to leave quicker than it would normally have. so this also affect the community in the long run and not in a good way.

You act like the devs killed your cat. Like, came over, pet it a few times, said they loved it, and then ran their car over it. Take a step back and think about what you're actually upset about. All those people claiming theyre just horrified by this update and the detriment it brings on their genderless/dittos/HP pokes? They'll either get over it, or they'll quit. But the game presses onward, and like I've said over and over again, the game is now in a better position than it was before the update (you've even claimed to agree with this?)

 

Here's another thing you're just completely ignoring - no matter what the devs do, there will always be a group of complainers that "spread hate towards the devs." It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario, so claiming that this particular update is the sole reason for this is super short-sighted. Not to mention, you've been here for what, 10 minutes? This has been happening update after update after update for the last 5 years, and like I said in my last post (something you chose to ignore), I've been in your camp before. I've been there in the mob with the pitchfork claiming that they fucked up the game with an update. But over time, I've been able to realize that every single choice by the devs will leave some people unhappy, and if the overall impact is good then I'm fine with the changes. Maybe one day you'll be able to see that, too, instead of just claiming you know how to fix things better (cough, pachima)

 

6 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

 

from my time i spent in the game talking with many different people i could see that people want to trust the devs to be good with us but sadly many are on the edge of giving up. this is only due to a lack of concern from the devs

 

Your own personal experience talking with, I dk, 5 or 6 people probably, is not representative of the overall feelings of the community and holds absolutely no weight here

6 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

also since i see that you missinterpreted this: 

i'll give you a quick explanation. this meant that if the grind for pvp here gets too anoying people will just go away from pokemmo to go to that battle simulator aka another game.

I understood it 100% - and my counter point was that the grind for PVP just got LESS annoying - once existing players get over the hump of having to rebreed a few comps. Seems I'm not the one with problems interpreting things

 

6 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

 

last thing could you please @Gunthug stop and think a little more about what someone is trying to say, maybe read it a few time and don't stop thinking at the first sense you see because there can be more than one and you could just be getting the wrong one

It shouldn't be my responsibility to craft your arguments so that they represent the best possible version of themselves. I'm not getting on you for English not being your first language, there's nothing you can do about that, but when I've responded to you 5 times with why I think your arguments are bad, perhaps its the arguments themselves you need to look at, not how I'm interpreting them.

[ThePrettyPetard]

6 minutes ago, Gunthug said:

you, on the other hand, spent that time pitying them and trying to look sympathetic instead of actually addressing any of my counter points

i didn't address much of your conter point becaus i allready stated that for half i was with you and for the other half you where basically saying "i don't care about those people" wich isn't something that you can counter/address in any other way than trying to open your eyes like i was trying to do.

 

12 minutes ago, Gunthug said:

Here's another thing you're just completely ignoring - no matter what the devs do, there will always be a group of complainers that "spread hate towards the devs." It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario, so claiming that this particular update is the sole reason for this is super short-sighted. Not to mention, you've been here for what, 10 minutes? This has been happening update after update after update for the last 5 years, and like I said in my last post (something you chose to ignore), I've been in your camp before. I've been there in the mob with the pitchfork claiming that they fucked up the game with an update. But over time, I've been able to realize that every single choice by the devs will leave some people unhappy, and if the overall impact is good then I'm fine with the changes. Maybe one day you'll be able to see that, too, instead of just claiming you know how to fix things better (cough, pachima)

well i can sort agree with you that there will always be people complaining but that is why you should try to make this number the smallest possible. if it take 2 year of work to get 2% more people happy then yes it isn't worth it to delay the update but if it only 1 week to get 10% more people happy insted of angry why not do it? you also claimed (i think it was you too lazy to check and quote you) that we will never get anything done if we try to make everyone happy, but that way we would never get an happy comunity and just add something to the list of thing we will never have. your vision only leave place to a need to always kill some of our loyal player to improve the game when there isn't always such a need. there are other alternative to sacrifice.

 

26 minutes ago, Gunthug said:

Your own personal experience talking with, I dk, 5 or 6 people probably, is not representative of the overall feelings of the community and holds absolutely no weight here

assuming the number of people i talked this with isn't a nice way to have an argument with someone it just feel like your throwing dirt on me when you could have just asked with how many people i talked with. even if i only talked with 5 or 6 people if they come from different group and all give the same anwser then even if the sample is very small it still show an obvious patern. but due to my random nature i probably got the opinion of something around 10 people completly unrelated to me or each other (might be related becaus of the small comunity but still where contacted radomly) and the patern i saw was more than obviously showed the same concern at different level.

39 minutes ago, Gunthug said:

It shouldn't be my responsibility to craft your arguments so that they represent the best possible version of themselves. I'm not getting on you for English not being your first language, there's nothing you can do about that, but when I've responded to you 5 times with why I think your arguments are bad, perhaps its the arguments themselves you need to look at, not how I'm interpreting them.

well i am sorry that my tendency to leave things unclear sometime might affect your ability to understand my argument but you also claimed that i missed your argument has well so maybe we both need to work on getting understood better.

[gbwead]

3 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

but you also claimed that i missed your argument has well so maybe we both need to work on getting understood better.

You are totally right here: @Gunthug's posts are such a massive clump of nonsense that they often don't even warrant a response xD

[Gunthug]

23 minutes ago, gbwead said:

You are totally right here: @Gunthug's posts are such a massive clump of nonsense that they often don't even warrant a response xD

How dare you

[Malorne]

18 hours ago, Darkshade said:

Well sacrificing a goat is a part of the initiation, not everybody has the stomach for it.

 

  Hide contents

Mandatory disclaimer about this being a joke

Does the reputation increase per goat or? its legal here so... i can probably overthrow kyu with a minor massacre

[EssDeeCee]

19 hours ago, Squirtle said:

Not to be mean or anything but just because you become part of the staff team does not mean you have any influence or knowledge of future game mechanics. Future game mechanics and balance techniques are discussed and driven by a very select few staff spearheaded by Kyu.

Well that explains it then.

 

A small group spearheaded by someone else who doesn't actually play the game often and therefore has no idea what actually goes on within the game itself.

 

But more RP items?????

 

[Gunthug]

1 hour ago, EssDeeCee said:

Well that explains it then.

 

A small group spearheaded by someone else who doesn't actually play the game often and therefore has no idea what actually goes on within the game itself.

 

But more RP items?????

 

why do you even post here if you're not gonna respond to anyone who replies to you?

[anheroin]

On 2/27/2018 at 10:29 PM, Xatu said:

Except complaining DOES do things.  My state just made cannabis legal, that shit didnt just happen on its own lmao!

Degeneracy at its finest. 

[Kite]

So let me get this straight. People are mad that dittos are not mandatory for breeding Genderless pokemon and now the value for them drops? 

Why would you want them to have extremely high value to begin with? If you support them being extremely high then all you care about is greed and not the longevity of the game. The way genderless pokemon can breed now should had been a thing since breeding was implemented. 

[suigin]

11 hours ago, EssDeeCee said:

Well that explains it then.

 

A small group spearheaded by someone else who doesn't actually play the game often and therefore has no idea what actually goes on within the game itself.

 

But more RP items?????

 

If they were playing the game you'd be bitching that they aren't fixing the broken stuff, just stop posting.

Edited March 3, 2018 by suigin

[ThePrettyPetard]

7 hours ago, suigin said:

If they were playing the game you'd be bitching that they aren't fixing the broken stuff, just stop posting.

they don't need to play the game 8 hours a day tho they could just come either one day per week or even something like 1 hour a day that could help them be more aware of the game without loosing to much time to code stuff

[Kizhaz]

2 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

they don't need to play the game 8 hours a day tho they could just come either one day per week or even something like 1 hour a day that could help them be more aware of the game without loosing to much time to code stuff

Why do people assume they don't know what's happening in their own game?

[ThePrettyPetard]

3 minutes ago, Kizhaz said:

Why do people assume they don't know what's happening in their own game?

maybe becaus they crash some stuff harder than they need to be like the genderless price

 

edit: also we don't see them on fairly often i only ever saw 1 on when it wasn't right after an update and when i ask people if they see them the usual anwser is extremly rarely

Edited March 3, 2018 by ThePrettyPetard

[Kizhaz]

4 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

maybe becaus they crash some stuff harder than they need to be like the genderless price

That's not proven, and quite frankly I still disagree. If nerfing one thing fixes a bunch of others, I'd say that's ok

[DaftCoolio]

Just now, ThePrettyPetard said:

maybe becaus they crash some stuff harder than they need to be like the genderless price

how did they know that they needed to fix genderless breeding if they don't know what's happening in their own game?

[ThePrettyPetard]

2 minutes ago, Kizhaz said:

That's not proven, and quite frankly I still disagree. If nerfing one thing fixes a bunch of others, I'd say that's ok

if that isn't the case and they do play the game then they are not using enough time to counter the downside of idea that make some huge change they lack of retrospective things. it's basically saying hello to new player and a good old fuck you to the old one loyal to the game.

[Kizhaz]

8 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

if that isn't the case and they do play the game then they are not using enough time to counter the downside of idea that make some huge change they lack of retrospective things. it's basically saying hello to new player and a good old fuck you to the old one loyal to the game.

Yet you still have everything, and they are still useful in breeding/comp/pve. Like I mentioned in my original post this update is similar to the lucky egg and phys/spec split ones

[ThePrettyPetard]

1 minute ago, Kizhaz said:

Yet you still have everything, and they are still useful in breeding/comp/pve. Like I mentioned in my original post this update is similar to the lucky egg and phys/spec split ones

that is where you are wrong what you don't have anymore is the ridiculously high amount of money it took to make tho genderless comp. if someone fairly new invested like 3m in a genderless comp then he doesn't have any money and any advantage (by having a harder pokemon to get) his investement that could have worked good if it was made sooner is now not even on par with the other being higher than him just becaus they invested in genderless after the update and add to that he is now broke and can't even make something else or fix his original genderless. it basically only punish some player for wanting to be the best too soon

[Bishav]

47 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

maybe becaus they crash some stuff harder than they need to be like the genderless price

 

31 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

if that isn't the case and they do play the game then they are not using enough time to counter the downside of idea that make some huge change they lack of retrospective things. it's basically saying hello to new player and a good old fuck you to the old one loyal to the game.

 

11 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

that is where you are wrong what you don't have anymore is the ridiculously high amount of money it took to make tho genderless comp. if someone fairly new invested like 3m in a genderless comp then he doesn't have any money and any advantage (by having a harder pokemon to get) his investement that could have worked good if it was made sooner is now not even on par with the other being higher than him just becaus they invested in genderless after the update and add to that he is now broke and can't even make something else or fix his original genderless. it basically only punish some player for wanting to be the best too soon

Jesus Christ

 

Do you know the price of semi shitty 31 speed Aerodactyl before breeding was implemented? It was worth a shiny.

And a year later, breeding was implemented.

 

Do you know the price of a 5x31 pokemon when ivs were passed randomly?

It was ridiculous.

And a year later, iv passing was implemented

 

Do you know the price of a 5x 28+ ditto during clonemmo days? 

It was extremely high as well

Pokemon getting consumed was implemented later as well.

 

Or do you know the drop prices of pokemon that became useless after physical/special split?

I missed a few more updates but you get the jist. The updates surely caused a lot of ups and downs in the prices of pokemon, but in retrospection all of them were necessary.

 

An update that benefits in the long run of the game is always better than having a stagnant game with a joke for an economy. 

I'm very grateful that the devs don't poll the updates like OSRS that someone(or you?) mentioned earlier on this thread. As the polls will reveal the biased opinion of a guy who doesn't want his time to go to waste.

 

Let me tell you, they do care about their playerbase a lot more than they did in the past. 

There is a lot more interaction between the devs and players than what used to happen in the past.

 

Edited March 3, 2018 by Bishav

[Kizhaz]

8 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

that is where you are wrong what you don't have anymore is the ridiculously high amount of money it took to make tho genderless comp. if someone fairly new invested like 3m in a genderless comp then he doesn't have any money and any advantage (by having a harder pokemon to get) his investement that could have worked good if it was made sooner is now not even on par with the other being higher than him just becaus they invested in genderless after the update and add to that he is now broke and can't even make something else or fix his original genderless. it basically only punish some player for wanting to be the best too soon late

But they still have the Pokemon they bred, they can sell that to make a new, cheaper genderless Pokemon. It would just be unfortunate timing if this happened but it's no reason to undo any of the changes. The update isn't a punishment and shouldn't be seen as such, it's making things easier for everyone as a whole. 

[ThePrettyPetard]

4 minutes ago, Bishav said:

 

 

Jesus Christ

 

Do you know the price of semi shitty 31 speed Aerodactyl before breeding was implemented? It was worth a shiny.

And breeding was implemented a year late.

 

Do you know the price of a 5x31 pokemon when ivs were passed randomly?

It was ridiculous.

And iv passing was implemented a year late as well.

 

Do you know the price of a 5x 28+ ditto during clonemmo days? 

It was extremely high as well

Implemented late as well.

 

Or do you know the drop prices of pokemon that became useless after physical/special split?

I missed a few more updates but you get the jist. The updates surely caused a lot of ups and downs in the prices of pokemon, but in retrospection all of them were necessary.

those change affected everyone more equally tho beside for the early one with the aero the genderless is much more specific. i would also like if you could mention pokemon that became completly useless after the split becaus i can't think of any i only some moveset that would need to be changed (not saying you are wrong but i can't say your right either with that one)

 

16 minutes ago, Bishav said:

I'm very grateful that the devs don't poll the updates like OSRS that someone(or you?) mentioned earlier on this thread. As the polls will reveal the biased opinion of a guy who doesn't want his time to go to waste.

i wasn't the one that suggested it but i do like the concept but rather than needing a % of vote to actually update the game just let the patch note in an open discussion one week before making it live to discuss with the comunity of thing that could be changed to make the most people happy before before either making it live or rework the update if there is many concern

15 minutes ago, Kizhaz said:

But they still have the Pokemon they bred, they can sell that to make a new, cheaper genderless Pokemon. It would just be unfortunate timing if this happened but it's no reason to undo any of the changes. The update isn't a punishment and shouldn't be seen as such, it's making things easier for everyone as a whole. 

i don't want this update to be undo though unlike many seems to think. i am 100% for the genderless change in breeding for the future benefit but i am also 100% against leaving behind people with unfortunate timing

[Bearminator]

52 minutes ago, ThePrettyPetard said:

those change affected everyone more equally tho beside for the early one with the aero the genderless is much more specific. 

Not really, if you wanted to have good comp you had to either sell shiny or egg or be reaaaaly lucky. Situation before this update- It affected everyone because if you wanted goodgenderless comp you could either grind or sell shiny , since alot dittos were valued around 2-3 m

 

[ThePrettyPetard]

12 minutes ago, Bearminator said:

Not really, if you wanted to have good comp you had to either sell shiny or egg or be reaaaaly lucky. Situation before this update- It affected everyone because if you wanted goodgenderless comp you could either grind or sell shiny , since alot dittos were valued around 2-3 m

 

not sure i get your point there since you are talking specifically about genderless when that wasn't exactly the thing we where talking about on the quote