YagamiNoir

Don't see how it's easy to mispredict against a Houndoom, in some cases, at least. Houndoom needs to reveal Sunny Day to pull off SunnyBeam, unless you're talking about sun support from an ally, so you can't say you'll actually mispredict over there. That's also 3 moves you're getting to know. Liechi Boost and continuous Sub spam can also be a dead giveaway it's Reversal too, and even if it isn't, some Petaya set isn't that broken either. Houndoom's sets are...dedicative, for lack of a better term, they are things that are paired specifically to be useful instead of things that can be thrown around here and there in the case of SunnyBeam/Reversal. It should never be too late to actually respond to these, although it makes some counters ineffective. The only situation that is nasty is the whole Pursuit/Crunch bit, and I suppose Destiny Bond, but people really need to get over that thing. Not to offend the creator of the separate thread being Raiddn, but the discussion itself back then was pretty stupid as it is. Taunt screws Toxic, but Houndoom has thick 4MSS. It can't run one set and get away with it, noting that without Taunt or Sub stuff like Clefable and other reasonably bulky wall can just Toxic it to avoid death through DBond when you manage to drive it into a corner, and with Taunt/DBond, you lose a portion of coverage. This is probably just a case of UU Gengar overhype. Claydol can always set up Reflect first or when predicting the switch if it has it, and if Claydol can kill Houndoom, don't expect to justify that Claydol is Pursuit prey. "If they stay in, they do the same damage." So, would you rather not do anything and get free damage or get either the same damage or far less depending on prediction while being able to pull something off? Like I said above, predicting Pursuit can backfire on the Houndoom user since you won't be able to do as much and if they have something to do to you you're screwed up. Apparently priority is also irrelevant now for some reason. I'd talk more, but like you Archi, busy.

Depends on who it's from, don't expect it to hurt as much as you'd like depending on the spread if you're a Hypno, and even Haunter can't even 2HKO that effin thing. 252 SpA Haunter Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Vileplume: 74-88 (40.6 - 48.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

I personally think Vileplume should be put up at least to A+, if not S itself. While admittedly it's not the most bulky thing in the world, it's proven to have consistently high usage and is debatably even the most common cleric even if it provides solely Aromatherapy support, given it's strong synergy alongside some other prominent defensive Pokemon in the metagame. It's admittedly something the council had in mind post Slowking/Scizor ban, although I suppose we have to wait and see. Moreso the removal of those two does provide it with better reliability somewhat because it was a free switch to Scizor unless it had HP Fire. With the ability to run tankiness on both spectrums it can check, if not counter, a fair variety of things, as well as other annoying utility moves in Leech Seed and Sleep Powder, and reliable recovery to top that off. It's also not that weak offensively as well, being able to run an offensive set being desirable and Sludge Bomb poisons can be troublesome for more frailer checks that want to switch in on it.

Funny how Pursuit and Crunch is never added to the equation now when it's one of two most significant moves that make Houndoom good at what it does which is to Pursuit trap squishies. It generally isn't banworthy apart from the fact that "Oh snap he killed my Psychic/Ghost type, now something's gonna rekt me because I lose this thing!" Especially considering Houndoom doesn't usually run CB, predicting Pursuit traps can be rewarding to the player against the Houndoom especially if they carry a particular Hidden Power and stuff, since it's not all that powerful anyway. Destiny Bond hype is overridden by how priority *cough* Hitmonlee/Hitmontop/Breloom* can just flat out kill it although the lattermost can't switch in, and an offensive Fire type isn't something that should bring a lot of problems to UU. If anything, Fire types balance the omnipresent Steelix and Vileplume, the latter of which Houndoom kinda checks pretty well with Early Bird (if some want to risk sleep, I guess) Taunt and a Fire move. I mean, we have Ninetales, which with Calm Mind can debatably at least be on par with this thing, except it also has more bulk sometimes as well, in regards to the whole "nothing beats SunnyBeam apart from Chansey" thing. SunnyBeam really shouldn't be that overhyped, not should anyone complain it to be banworthy for that matter. It still gets a few nice tricks, though. SubReversal for the lulz, gg no re Chansey/Porygon2. +1 Houndoom Reversal (200 BP) vs. 252/148+ Porygon2: 227-268 (118.2 - 139.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO EDIT: To Zebra: "Not really. Slowking was a counter to non cb houndoom. Now only chansey handles stab fire+solarbeam in sun" 252 Atk Houndoom Crunch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowking: 90-108 (44.5 - 53.4%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery This is still pretty close and that's ignoring the 20% Defense drop chance, for that matter. Slowking can OHKO back but "counter" is exaggerated.

While that's true, thinking of it in a more generous perspective pointing stuff out also gives us the awareness of fixing our mistakes instead of leaving them like that. But I suppose PM would be more appropriate.

..No idea what you were thinking when you wrote this critique, but that's just me. I'll firstly say you obviously didn't read it correctly though. Firstly, Teleportation has nothing to do with deconstruction. At all. Teleportation is an instantaneous form of transport either through telekinesis (which is likely what is being used here). It means as well to disappear and reappear instantaneously through whatever special mean, but you don't have to deconstruct your body to do so. That would be time consuming by itself. If you've seen the anime, the XY Champion, Diantha, has a Gardevoir that can blink and teleport even without the move itself. That's how Pokemon logic works anime-wise. There isn't really that harsh of a limit to what Pokemon can do. If you want to play the logic game, an accurate response/interception to an ExtremeSpeed with Psycho Cut/Teleport would obviously involve a lot of force, which is also influenced by the speed and accuracy of the two Pokemon. Gallade teleported backward. Lucario was behind Gallade, so why would it need to Teleport forward? If you were referring to the other one, if you appear suddenly and the opponent wouldn't have much time to react, you would hit with as much accuracy/power as possible since your opponent wouldn't have the ability to respond as quickly, although throughout all this Gallade just wanted to intercept Lucario instead of flinch it, if anything. Read carefully, dude, nothing's wrong with two Pokemon pouring their battle cries especially in the big heat of a battle, unless you'd rather I say they "shouted" or whatever at the peak of their tone, which would sound more bland if anything. Your statement of "We" sounded more as if the trainers were doing it, which is again, false. Even then, nothing's wrong with formality either, and if anything that's how most of my work is done anyway. Found a few spelling errors actually, thanks for the note. It's more of the punctuation than anything, unless you prove me wrong. See below. EDIT: If I am to be again blunt on something, this is coming from the writer who can't even write in standard punctuation in which the moves of Pokemon should be capitalized, which affects how professionally you portray your work. My apologies for speaking in such a way.

My bets are too devilishly scary, aren't they?

I really don't exactly understand the whole hype on Quagsire countering physical threats. Choice Band Hitmonlee Superpower vs. Quagsire: 128-151 (63.3 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery -1 Choice Band Hitmonlee Superpower vs. Quagsire: 86-102 (42.5 - 50.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

I feel sad how this is being ignored.

I could care less, it's your loss. Not srs. Those two have changed. The Smeargle trainers still have four Smeargles.

Pardon the double post. Someone delete or merge it, and the like. I guess it's my turn to debut. 1500 words. [spoiler] Here we were. At the Shalour gym, where I would encounter the Fighting Gym Leader, Korrina. The blond female and her Lucario stood before me in the admittedly empty battlefield, with only the two of us, and a onlooking referee. Gallade stood close by me -- his scarlet, collected eyes that told me he would do his best, firmly holding our bonding item -- the Mega Stone -- tied to it's fist. "The rules are simple." Korrina anounced enthusiatiscally. "We will use our Mega Pokemon in a one-on-one battle. Whoever defeats the other will win, and if you emerge victorious, you shall be worthy of this badge." "Be things as they may." I said. "I won't hold back." "I like your spirit." Lucario stepped forward into the battlefield. "Beyond the limit! Mega Evolution!" We announced together, activating the accessory we were wearing. The Mega Stones responded to our respective Mega Rings as we witnessed the evolution occur. In a magnificent display of blinding, purple light, the two Fighting-type Pokemon had evolved. Most of Gallade's green body had turned into a magnificent, clear white, and Gallade now had a cape on it's back, giving it a rather knightly appearance. The edges of its blade-like elbows had scarlet plates adorning them. And Lucario had changed vastly as well, with the cream fur thinking and it too, having new red patterns on some parts of it's body, such as the tips of it's appendages and near the eyes, and additional spikes on it's arms as well. Both Pokemon stared into each other's eyes confidently and carefully, veins quivering with fighting instinct and adrenaline, knowing that their opponent before them was a strong one. There was endless silence and bare movement, and both trainers knew that psychological tactics were being brought to the table. Both Pokemon were expertised in predicting the movements of others, and the trainers thusly they knew that a careless mistake would cost them the match, watching each other with acknowledgement. "So, let's begin!" Korrina exclaimed."Lucario, Power-Up-Punch!" The Aura Pokemon's fists ignited with a surge of furious, orange aura as Lucario rushed towards its target at an incredible speed. Gallade readied itself, forearms crossed, poised for attack. "Drain Punch!" Gallade responded with a power-surged punch of draining energy of his own. The two pairs of fists intercepted. "Aura Sphere!" "Psycho Cut!" A forceful sphere of aura energy blasted from Lucario's arms as a crescent, curved cut-like projectile of psychic energy exuded from Gallade's -- they met in an explosion in mid-air, creating vague puffs of dust that blinded all in the battlefield. The smoke cleared to reveal both Pokemon unscathed. "Again!" Korrina commanded, lunging her first forward, as if punching something."Aura Sphere!" "Knock it back with Psycho Cut!" As Lucario launched the blue sphere of aura toward its target, Gallade calmly caught it in a spinning motion with it's arms empowered with psychic energy, before reversing the attack back at Lucario. Korrina was surprised at the move, but she quickly recovered and commanded, "Bone Rush! Block the attack, and proceed on!" "Psycho Cut, en melee!" Lucario formed thrust-like weapons that were shaped like bones in its paws. After easily blocking the returned Aura Sphere attack, it lunged a pair of bones at Lucario as projectiles, before forming more to face Gallade in close combat. Gallade dodged the first two before meeting it's opponent with it's twin swords, the keen edges of their blades empowered with pink psychic energy. The infight was intense between two skilled melee fighters, bone and blade clashing between one another endlessly and in swift, powerful motions. The fight ended equally, although I knew that with Lucario's previous Power-Up-Punch, it had the advantage in power, and with Adapability even more so. I could sense the intensity in Lucario's raging fists as they lashed upon Gallade, the power they yielded, and the aura they released -- Korrina's Mega Lucario was exceedingly powerful. The two Pokemon stopped clashing momentarily, withdrawing their weapons. "Equal footing." Korrina said. "Then let's see you handle this! Lucario, ExtremeSpeed!" "Gallade, ready yourself. Teleport!" Lucario dashed behind Gallade at an unseen speed as if it had teleported. Gallade however anticipated the attack and intercepted the speedy Pokemon with a Psycho Cut attack, disappearing initially and reappearing in front of Lucario's new location with accurate precision. "What?" The gym leader was taken aback by how Gallade easily blocked Lucario's backstab attempt. "Gallade's not that easy to get past." "Intercepting Lucario's fastest attack.....I'm impressed with that Mega Gallade. I can't say anyone has ever intercepted Lucario's attacks fully, nor ever go on par with it's power or speed. It's its Inner Focus, is it? Such wonderful courage. I like an opponent like that." "Gallade has powerful precision." Gallade's Inner Focus indeed helped, as it meant that Gallade wouldn't be flinched or give hindered responses to powerful attacks. As I replied, I contemplated on her strategy. By itself, it's pretty straightforward, but very rewarding. With each consecutive use of Power-Up-Punch, Lucario's attacks become more difficult to intercept due to their increasing intensity. As well as the passive intensity of Lucario's aura building up......a lengthy battle with it would prove troublesome. I needed to find an opportunity, preferably one where Gallade could take it out with a single move..... "Lucario, combine ExtremeSpeed with Power-Up-Punch! Knock it upward!" "Intercept it! Teleport, then Psycho Cut!" I had expected Lucario to aim for Gallade, and Gallade had responded to Lucario's swift charge accurately. However, Lucario had feinted the approach, and instead punched the ground. The force of it was strong enough to knock Gallade up into the air in a powerful, aura-powered tremor.The attack caught me off guard, and Gallade was now vulnerable in mid-air. "Another time! Power-Up-Punch!" "Block with Psycho Cut!" Lucario's punches headed downward and for the head, as Gallade blocked them. Gallade had attempted and early interception so as to reduce the pressure of the fall. Both Pokemon dropped to the ground in a powerful thud in a puff of suffocating smoke. The battle was still far from over, and both Pokemon still stood, still capable of fighting. However, Lucario was only going to get stronger and stronger. Korrina had commanded four uses of Power-Up-Punch, and Gallade was gradually succumbing to the increasing intensity of Lucario's attacks. "Good technique." Korrina remarked. "Blocking Power-Up-Punch before it reached its full speed to reduce the impact. Smart, but it looks like those punches took their toll. If you're going to drive me this far, you'll see me at my full power." "No need for tedious talk. Come!" "Let's settle this! Bone Rush, then Power-Up-Punch!" Lucario launched a barrage of the bone-like projectiles towards the Blade Pokemon, before leaping into the air with a pair of raging fists urging to decimate its opponent. Again a simple yet potent technique to distract with a wide-range attack before corresponding with a hard-hitting one -- yet within a seemingly bad dilemma I was in, I knew what to do. Gallade watched me, and I knew this would be the time to test our little trump card. I would fight fire with fire. "Dodge and use Psycho Cut!" After dodging the array of Bone Rush attacks, Gallade hurled the strongest crescent blade he could muster towards Lucario. It ended up missing it's target, but I didn't flinch -- it was part of my plan.... "Now, intercept with Teleport and Psycho Cut, full power!" "Are you certain you can take this head on?" Korrina asked. "Lucario's boosted itself a lot!" Both Pokemon lunged each other while emptying their vocal chords with relentless battle cries. It was a foolish idea to take on Lucario directly after it had used so many Power-Up-Punches. However, I knew I would still win the trade. Korrina hadn't noticed the former Psycho Cut return back to Lucario from behind as if it were a boomerang. Combined with the intensity of Teleport and Psycho Cut, Gallade was easily able to overpower Lucario with attacks from both sides as they collided simultaneously. "No way!" "This ends. Drain Punch!" And Gallade dealt the finishing blow -- Gallade's right first surged emerald with draining energy, landing a direct hit on Lucario, that took super effective damage due to it's Steel typing. There was a mild puff of smoke, and the Mega Evolved Lucario reverted back to it's original form after being defeated. It stood lethargic and unable to battle on the ground, slightly bruised and injured. "Lucario is unable to battle. Gallade wins!" Korrina seemed alright with her loss, withdrawing Lucario into her Pokeball, before approaching me with a slight smile. "What an incredible bond you have! What amazing power! With a bond such as yours, you can overcome any obstacle. I thank you for a wonderful battle." "Here." She passed me what I came here for, the fist-shaped Rumble Badge, signifying my third gym badge win in Kalos. Gallade and I accepted our win and my badge with strong satisfaction. "You prove yourself worthy of the Rumble Badge." [/spoiler]

Guide edited slightly; Added Golbat on the Speed section and removed Special Attack from the NPC section. Also added clarification on the Magma Hideout Spot.

Expect a likely submission by tonight, if not tomorrow. Doing it early because exams are around the corner. I guess I'll reserve it here.

Misdreavus/Mismagius confusion over here, too. Not to be rude. " Misdreavus launches another Shadow Ball. This still can't KO me right? A critical hit. Oh god why."

They say the only time you crave for fruits Is when the trees meet their end. They say the only time you complain of your money Is when you no longer have any to spend. They say the only time you wish for your youth Is when it passes, ending, without avail. They say the only time you wish for you wish for another chance Is when you lose your last, the result, but an empty fail. They say the only time you wish for the moon Is when you find you've counted the stars too soon. Do you permit your contrition To take over you, amidst your confusion? Do you give in to your remorse And lose the winning play in your court? Do you succumb to your sorrow Giving up what is to come tomorrow? Do you allow yourself to rue And bid all else with but a simple adieu? You find a flower, but lose it's fragrance. "Regret", you subtly utter; Yet at a time it became your happy substance Why render it asunder? What stays in your reminiscence Will be your growing essence. The seven coloured bridge in a salubrious sky It needed the rain, that ruined your dry And to your qualms that bother you so To contrite is to ruin; learn, and let them go.

Deep stuff man, deep stuff. Makes me inclined to make one of these as well.

Does it need to be exact? Any other cosmetic but unimplemented features are prohibited?

I suppose I can make something. P.S All of this is pure fiction and I may include some possibly mildly concerning content of people I don't even know all that well. If you do find any of my content inappropriate I will edit it upon notice. [spoiler] My first year in MMO High was....an okay one, to say the least. Recalling this now, the day I end my first semester, it's been quite a lively and hustling year for me. Traversing back to memories of me first being here, I suppose my solitary demeanour and dark tendencies earned me the "blessed" title of the emo kid. I was kinda used to that, and thought that it'd be inevitable here if I was going to live by that name throughout a portion of high school. It wasn't worse, though, since I was more active this year, given college is a new start. I would walk to school every day, since it's just a stone's throw away from campus. While you'd think I'd be an idiot to walk back and forth during the day when I always wear black attire, the weather here can be pretty cool and relaxing, especially during the coming autumns, so I didn't sweat myself as much as people thought I would. I particularly enjoyed winter, since I enjoyed cold atmospheres. Entering the main hall, I'd see the usual lively crowd before class, and even if I wasn't one to interact much especially en masse, I knew the people there well. Everyone was of a different branch in college, pursuing their own respective ambitions. I'd first find Jay and Killiminati surrounded by a fairly large group of friends, particularly females seemingly charmed over their good-looking features. Cool hair, muscular builds and whatnot. I never really was clear of their courses, but I'd assumed they were taking business and economics like Tyrone did. Most loquacious students had gathered there such as Fred and TJXD, and their conversations overlapped within the endless noise so I could only presume what they were talking about. It wasn't surprising that I'd find Forfiter amongst their ranks as well, given he's probably the most avid whiteknight amongst the juniors. Needless to say, wherever he was being his whiteknighting self the more popular girls of the school were bound to be there as well, say Ploegy, Kazooka and RacheLucario, the art experts. The lattermost was probably the apple of everyone's eye that further attracted students into the noisy, chattering crowd, given she was likely the most popular girl in school as far as I knew anyway. Going through the crowd was difficult most of the time, so going up and down a flight of stairs was the easier way of getting past the hallways. There was quite a lot of famous names in school. The LYLE gang was one of them, given they rank amongst the top class students in our year, be it in academics or sports. There were people like Bowser, NikhilR and JSTUD with their achievements flying everywhere. There were also a lot of dominant people would gang together such as the Asgards and Aura, so the atmosphere was pretty competitive. There was this one guy called Senile who was probably the smartest guy in the school but was also a pretty obnoxious and degrading braggart some of the time. Sometimes, I'd see insults, or even fights, cross between him and a couple of other students whenever sass exchange happened in the corridors -- say maybe over half of the student body despised him, although I'm not part of that exceeding half. We also had the popular rich folk, say Archinix and CZD with their fancy, branded belongings. I'd hear a few lines from them left and right about the latest trends and economy. I wasn't a complete loner, and as I spent more time in this school, I had my fair of people who I got along with fairly well. I found myself getting along with students that were taking psychology, particularly ThinkNice and Noad. I'd always meet ThinkNice outside with "a special someone" beside him near the lockers as I exited the main halls, whereas Noad was probably busy tending to her pet cat she always hides in her locker but never gets penalized for it -- probably because the authorities never know it's there and that her cat was strangely quiet. Our conversations were enjoyable, to say the least. Orange and NightWing were also amongst my closer friends, given we'd always jam in the music rooms or studios when we had the chance. We'd even made a few concerts, with our own respective stage names; Disarming Voice, Hyper Voice and Perish Song. I wasn't one to sing like they both did, but I was always good at the piano, whereas Orange and NightWing were good with rock guitar. It was one of the more enjoyable things I did with friends during the first year, and of course, I'd look forward to them for the days to come. While they were studying music, my inclinations went more towards medicine, as I aspired to become a doctor. As someone with strong fluency with languages, I also got along with law and reporting students. To this, I also got along with other fellow students that share my interest such as DoubleJJ, Gunthug and Bestfriends. JJ and I got along pretty well since we'd discuss about work if it was hard. Gunthug was studying law and we both usually talked about our literary works, whereas Bestfriends, the school reporter, would greet me with anything interesting happening in school every day when I met him. I achieved satisfactory grades this year with a GPA of 3.9. All that studying I did didn't go to particular waste, and given the length of my desired courses taking a whooping ten or so years to complete, I didn't want to waste a year. I ranked in the top 10 in academics this year, although I'm not exactly sure how I'd feel about that achievement. I wasn't a Jack with all work and no play, and actively participated in stuff like discussions and debates, as well as the literary clubs. And I can only look forward to the next, drenching in the unknown mild wonder that of which whether I would enjoy my next year as much as this one. [/spoiler]

The Raticate was possibly previously damaged or he was simply making a vague example.

Endeavor's damage isn't affected by Attack/Defense, but rather, the amount of HP between the user and the target. The higher the target's HP and the lower the user's HP, the more effective the move is. "so if i get 350 dmg and i have 421 hp this means the ratticate should have 70 hp (whats the difference) oO" The Raticate had 71 HP to begin with, perhaps, yes. On something with very high HP like Snorlax, reducing 400+ HP to Raticate's miniscule 71 HP amount would be a really steep loss, and hence why "something so low leveled can do so much damage to a high leveled Pokemon. ."

Provide it to ThinkNice then, pretty much.

Not sure if you're donating your Yen, but the PSL would probably be the most efficient place to spend it on, if you are.

IGN: NightLucifer GMT + 10 Tiers: PokeMMO Doubles, ADV OU, DPP OU, VGC 2015.

Because physical attacking wasn't as rewarding and, well, surpassed that of the special attacking degree pre-split, but that's what I think anyways. EDIT: Moreso it was about Dugtrio trapping your Special wall and then your Special Attacker now ran amok, whereas at this point, the metagame is pretty much fast paced enough.

Sceptile's probably the unpredictable kind. You won't know if it'll run a move to screw up something you bring in to counter it, such as either a specific Hidden Power and the like. I'm pretty sure you can't find a 100% counter to this thing. The Swords Dance set seems a bit too off the hook. Crobat is probably the best thing against it. It can outspeed it, stop utility shenanigans with Taunt, has a Super Effective Dual STAB, and the like. A boosted ThunderPunch hurts it for an OHKO, noting that Crobat can't even reliably OHKO the thing with a 252 Sludge Bomb, but I suppose it works. Unless you run something like Choice Band Wing Attack. +2 Sceptile ThunderPunch vs. 4/0 Crobat: 156-184 (97.5 - 115%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO +2 Sceptile ThunderPunch vs. 252/0 Crobat: 156-184 (81.2 - 95.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO 0 Crobat Sludge Bomb vs. 4/0 Sceptile: 88-104 (60.2 - 71.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery 252 Crobat Sludge Bomb vs. 4/0 Sceptile: 122-144 (83.5 - 98.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery It's a kill factoring Poison, but it'll kill you next turn before it activates anyway if you're the squishy attacking Crobat. So the bulkier set generally fares against it better than the offensive one. Altaria can phaze away annoying SubSeed, but dislikes Dragon Claw (although running it solely for Altaria probably isn't really that good) or Hidden Power Ice. 252 Sceptile Hidden Power Ice vs. 252/252+ Altaria: 102-120 (56 - 65.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery +2 Sceptile Dragon Claw vs. 252/252 Altaria: 107-126 (58.7 - 69.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery +2 Sceptile Dragon Claw vs. 252/0 Altaria: 151-178 (82.9 - 97.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery Porygon2 is...alright, I guess. Let's see.... 0 SpA Porygon2 Ice Beam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Sceptile: 86-102 (58.9 - 69.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO +2 252 Atk Sceptile Leaf Blade vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Porygon2: 90-106 (46.8 - 55.2%) -- 14.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery +2 252 Atk Sceptile Brick Break vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Porygon2: 100-118 (52 - 61.4%) -- 95.3% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery I spoke too soon, but I suppose it can work. Vileplume is immune to probably it's most annoying set being SubSeed. It's notable that Sceptile lives one Sludge Bomb from full health although Poison hax will finish it off, and there may come some cases where it may run less Speed for some bulk, but I don't know. 252/0 Vileplume is 2HKOed by +2 Earthquake/Aerial Ace, but I suppose it still fares fine. If you're physically Defensive, Aerial Ace is still a pain, but I suppose you can settle it. 0 Vileplume Sludge Bomb vs. 4/0 Sceptile: 119-140 (81.5 - 95.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery +2 Sceptile Aerial Ace vs. 252/0 Vileplume: 119-140 (65.3 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery +2 Sceptile Earthquake vs. 252/0 Vileplume: 98-116 (53.8 - 63.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery +2 Sceptile Aerial Ace vs. 252/252+ Vileplume: 85-100 (46.7 - 54.9%) -- 14.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery And...that's it. I don't see anything anything really managing to wall this thing apart from maybe say Armaldo, which is annoyed the hell out of SubSeed. It also gets things like Endeavor/Quick Attack, which is a pain. That and you probably only have Crobat and Swellow as revenge kill mediums for this thing. EDIT: Bellossom can work provided it doesn't have Aerial Ace and has a Hidden Power to work with, but well, Bellossom. Special sets aren't as threatening as physical sets, making it probably the better option when opting for it offensively. While Off Topic, if Shiftry benefits from Nature Power/Earthquake here, it'd might be a worthy contender and stuff. EDIT 2: Unless I'm missing some counters here, I'd advocate for a BL ban.