Tips for improving my OU team

[Aleventinove]

Hi guys, I'm looking for some tips to improve my OU team. After some matches with it, I feel like I'm still struggling with some matchups, despite being IMO quite a balanced team, at least on paper.

 

GLISCOR (poison heal) @ Toxic Orb. 

Nature: Jolly

- Earthquake

- U-Turn

- Defog

- Protect

 

ROTOM WASH (levitate) @ Leftovers.

Nature: Calm

- Hydro Pump

- Volt Switch

- Will-o-wisp

- Pain Split

 

REUNICLUS (magic guard) @ Life Orb

Nature: Bold

- Psyshock

- Focus Blast

- Calm Mind

- Recover

 

SCIZOR (Technician) @ Choice Band

Nature: Adamant

- Bullet Punch

- U-Turn

- Close Combat

- Aerial Ace

 

EMPOLEON (Torrent) @ Leftovers

Nature: Calm

- Scald

- Toxic

- Stealth Rock

- Roost

 

WEAVILE (Pressure) @ Choice Band

Nature: Jolly

- Ice Shard

- Icicle Spear

- Night Slash

- Low Kick

 

Particularly, I'm not sure wether to replace Empoleon with something else (even though it is a good answer to Choice Specs Kingdra under rain). 

Also, Power Whip Gyarados and some offensive mons such as Infernape gave me some headaches as well.

I'd like to keep Reuniclus if possible, because it's shiny and I'm trying to build a team around it.

Thanks

 

Alessio

[DiosSlurpuff]

Hi.
The team doesn't see it as bad to start with, but anyway I would love to make some corrections to improve it a bit:

 

On 6/5/2023 at 4:50 PM, Aleventinove said:

GLISCOR (poison heal) @ Toxic Orb. 

Nature: Jolly

- Earthquake

- U-Turn

- Defog

- Protect

This set looks good to me, just with an Impish nature, and I'd use stealth rock instead of defog, since Gliscor can't comfortably use defog against certain highly-seen mons like rotom, garchomp mixed, etc.

 

On 6/5/2023 at 4:50 PM, Aleventinove said:

ROTOM WASH (levitate) @ Leftovers.

Nature: Calm

- Hydro Pump

- Volt Switch

- Will-o-wisp

- Pain Split

I see this rotom as bold nature, it is the point of using WoW.
I would use WoW, Hydro Pump, Defog and Volt Switch, I think that would be the best alternative.
Ev's: 252 HP / 166 Defense / 92 Speed

The EV spreads in speed are to overcome Scizor, be able to use WoW on it and leave it useless for the rest of the fight.

 

On 6/5/2023 at 4:50 PM, Aleventinove said:

REUNICLUS (magic guard) @ Life Orb

Nature: Bold

- Psyshock

- Focus Blast

- Calm Mind

- Recover

I don't see it well in this team, I think you should prioritize covering yourself with mons like volcarona, chandelure, etc.

I suggest you use a chansey, although it is true that Chandelure scarf can use a trick to exchange items, it is still a good option if you know how to play it.

Bold Nature: 252 HP / 252 Defense / 6 SpDef, eviolite

 

On 6/5/2023 at 4:50 PM, Aleventinove said:

SCIZOR (Technician) @ Choice Band

Nature: Adamant

- Bullet Punch

- U-Turn

- Close Combat

- Aerial Ace

Choice band scizor uses pursuit, not aerial ace.

Using 2 cbands on the same team can still be dangerous for you though, I'll stick with Weavile and use this slot for something better.

If there is something you are missing is some special attacker, I could suggest you Hydreigon Choice scarf, Chandelure Choice Scarf, Hydreigon sub nplot, Gengar sub nplot, Chandelure sub calm mind, Togekiss calm mind + heal bell... It depends on your what you want use.

 

On 6/5/2023 at 4:50 PM, Aleventinove said:

EMPOLEON (Torrent) @ Leftovers

Nature: Calm

- Scald

- Toxic

- Stealth Rock

- Roost

In the slot I put this something that you are missing as well, a physical defender capable of dealing with Conkeldurr ice punch and other physical offensive with ice-type moves (Weavile, Metagross, etc).

I could suggest a Weezing rocky helmet for its capacity for neutralizate abilities, I see it as somewhat superior to, for example, Cofagrigus whose roles are similar.

mischievous nature
- Toxic
- Flamethrower
- Pain Split
- Haze / Thunderbolt

The set with thunderbolt carries speed to overcome Pelipper bold, which would be about 44 EVs in speed, if you take it with haze this amount of speed is not necessary.

 

On 6/5/2023 at 4:50 PM, Aleventinove said:

WEAVILE (Pressure) @ Choice Band

Nature: Jolly

- Ice Shard

- Icicle Spear

- Night Slash

- Low Kick

It's ok but chase him instead of low kick

 

 

 

 

Alternatives: Use Rotom Timid nature 252 HP/252 Speed with Hidden Power Fire/Ice instead of WoW.

As for the equipment, it is not the best equipment in the world, but it seems that you are just starting, so I gave you some things that are not complicated to use so that you learn how the game works while on the low ladder you lose. the fewest duels possible.

 

Good luck!

[caioxlive13]

51 minutes ago, DiosSlurpuff said:

Choice band scizor uses pursuit, not aerial ace.

Using 2 cbands on the same team can still be dangerous for you though, I'll stick with Weavile and use this slot for something better.

If there is something you are missing is some special attacker, I could suggest you Hydreigon Choice scarf, Chandelure Choice Scarf, Hydreigon sub nplot, Gengar sub nplot, Chandelure sub calm mind, Togekiss calm mind + heal bell... It depends on your what you want use.

I use Aerial Ace and works very well. Of course, it aren't too useful than before, because Conkeldurr's usage decayed a bit, mainly due to Breloom. But are still considerable and can caught volcarona and offensive grass on predicted switch-ins.

[Ramallero]

First of all congratulations for the Shiny Reuni!!!!!

I share a lot of the suggestions made by DiosSlurpuff, like the Impish nature on Gliscor and the bold one on Rotom.

This is a team I made trying to keep most of your pokemon:

https://pokepast.es/48df03000f0d1f46

-Chansey to give you a Special Wall (with teleport to pivot around) and Toxic to cripple the enemy foes (but T.Wave or aromateraphy also could be use)
-Dragonite because (in my opinion) every balanced team should have a setup sweeper, and Dragonite is just so good right now with Dragon Claws / Fire Punch giving almost perfect coverage, and extreme speed making him almost imposible to revenge kill (focus sash revenge killers like Weavile can be managed with Stealth Rock).
Lum berry to prevent T.wave / WoW cripple but you could use leftovers (specially if go with Aromateraphy on Chansey).
-The set in Reuniclus is fine but leftovers is much better, life orb works well with Modest nature and 3 attacks.
-I use Pursuit on Scizor to trap Starmie and low hp pokemon (but if you prefer a.a. go ahead).
-I prefer defog on Rotom and Rocks on Gliscor

Is not a perfect team, but has a solid defensive core with some offensive threats that is the purpose of balanced teams :)

[caioxlive13]

8 minutes ago, Ramallero said:

First of all congratulations for the Shiny Reuni!!!!!

I share a lot of the suggestions made by DiosSlurpuff, like the Impish nature on Gliscor and the bold one on Rotom.

This is a team I made trying to keep most of your pokemon:

https://pokepast.es/48df03000f0d1f46

-Chansey to give you a Special Wall (with teleport to pivot around) and Toxic to cripple the enemy foes (but T.Wave or aromateraphy also could be use)
-Dragonite because (in my opinion) every balanced team should have a setup sweeper, and Dragonite is just so good right now with Dragon Claws / Fire Punch giving almost perfect coverage, and extreme speed making him almost imposible to revenge kill (focus sash revenge killers like Weavile can be managed with Stealth Rock).
Lum berry to prevent T.wave / WoW cripple but you could use leftovers (specially if go with Aromateraphy on Chansey).
-The set in Reuniclus is fine but leftovers is much better, life orb works well with Modest nature and 3 attacks.
-I use Pursuit on Scizor to trap Starmie and low hp pokemon (but if you prefer a.a. go ahead).
-I prefer defog on Rotom and Rocks on Gliscor

Is not a perfect team, but has a solid defensive core with some offensive threats that is the purpose of balanced teams 🙂

Balanced don't work too well actually due to PP nerf, but good luck with him, looks pretty solid.

[DiosSlurpuff]

1 hour ago, caioxlive13 said:

I use Aerial Ace and works very well. Of course, it aren't too useful than before, because Conkeldurr's usage decayed a bit, mainly due to Breloom. But are still considerable and can caught volcarona and offensive grass on predicted switch-ins.

Pursuit catches Gengar and Starmie, I don't see the need to debate which is better, it's extremely obvious

[DiosSlurpuff]

1 hour ago, caioxlive13 said:

Balanced don't work too well actually due to PP nerf, but good luck with him, looks pretty solid.

Dude even stall works fine despite PP nerf

[caioxlive13]

11 minutes ago, DiosSlurpuff said:

Dude even stall works fine despite PP nerf

But it gets pressurized a lot by offense, that dominateed since the nerf. Or you play very well with almost no Blunder, or you lose.

[DiosSlurpuff]

3 minutes ago, caioxlive13 said:

Or you play very well with almost no Blunder, or you lose.

Like basically any type of equipment in high ladder... The nerf in pp only makes be careful of that, the game mode did not change

[Aleventinove]

Hey,

First of all, thanks for you answers so far. Suggestions from more experienced players are really important to get better.

 

I should have specified something from the very beginning: in my team I deliberately chose NOT to use any of the pink blobs, nor Amoonguss (I just find them annoying, both to use and to play against). Also, as I wrote in the opening post, I'd really like to use Reuniclus, if it's possible to do so on a competitive level.

Therefore, some choices I made regarding team composition are a consequence of the above.

For example, since I won't use a Chansey, my team will immediately be vulnerable to some special threats (Specs Kingdra and Volcarona most of all); hence why I chose Calm Empoleon for its role compression (stealth rock setter AND special wall that would be a very good counter to Kingdra, being able to Toxic stall him even under rain; it is also a viable answer to Volcarona, at least the variants without Substitute/Safeguard).

The same goes for Calm Rotom-W: since I can use WoW and try to burn some physical or mixed threats on the switch (such as Garchomp or Gallade), investing in Spdef, while not as common as the Bold variant, seemed a logical decision to me. 

Re Gliscor: everyone suggested to go for an Impish nature, and I can definitely see why. I chose Jolly with 140 Speed EV to outspeed everything up to Jolly Gallade with max speed investment (1v1, if I scout for Ice punch with Protect, I would be able to beat him this way). 

 

As you noted, this team composition has some issues:

- Physical attackers that can use both Ice and Fight coverage moves are hard to deal with. Conkeldurr is the most obvious example: burning him with Rotom would be of no use, and it can potentially OHKO both Empoleon and Gliscor depending on the set he uses. This brought me to use Aerial Ace on Scizor, since with CB he can reliably kill non Bulk Up variants

- I cannot provide a really solid answer to strong Fire STAB Physical attackers as well (Darmanitan and Infernape) 

- Gyarados with Power Whip can potentially snowball through my team. I thought about using Rindo Berry instead of Leftovers on Rotom for this reason

 

 

I've read some very useful tips that gave me some food of thought:

- I could try to use Rocks on Gliscor and Defog on Rotom. I would find myself more opportunities to set hazards this way, also I could put Roar on Empoleon instead of Defog; this would however come at the cost of losing Pain Split on Rotom as a way to recover HP (I always love to pain split against pink blobs switching on my Rotom to regain almost full HP)

- Using Leftovers instead of LO on Reuniclus could be very interesting and I could see myself trying that. I originally chose LO because having more damage output from the beginning is sometimes more useful; it's not easy to find chances to setup given the abundance of Dark mons in this meta

- Pursuit on Weavile would net me some more useful kills for sure. Without Low Kick, however, I miss the possibility of trying to surprise kill TTar or other Fighting weak mons (like Empoleon) on the switch. What would you think is better to give up for Pursuit: Night Slash or Low Kick?

- I agree that having 2 Banded mons in the team is potentially very dangerous. Weavile has proved itself invaluable so far, I just find it very good in the current metagame. I would like to replace Scizor with something else... I Really like Dragonite, not sure if having another 4x Ice Weakness is of any good for my team tho.

 

 

After I went into detail on some of my choices and my thought process, I'd love to hear more feedback from you to improve the team.

Thanks!

[Ramallero]

10 hours ago, Aleventinove said:

Hey,

First of all, thanks for you answers so far. Suggestions from more experienced players are really important to get better.

 

I should have specified something from the very beginning: in my team I deliberately chose NOT to use any of the pink blobs, nor Amoonguss (I just find them annoying, both to use and to play against). Also, as I wrote in the opening post, I'd really like to use Reuniclus, if it's possible to do so on a competitive level.

Therefore, some choices I made regarding team composition are a consequence of the above.

For example, since I won't use a Chansey, my team will immediately be vulnerable to some special threats (Specs Kingdra and Volcarona most of all); hence why I chose Calm Empoleon for its role compression (stealth rock setter AND special wall that would be a very good counter to Kingdra, being able to Toxic stall him even under rain; it is also a viable answer to Volcarona, at least the variants without Substitute/Safeguard).

The same goes for Calm Rotom-W: since I can use WoW and try to burn some physical or mixed threats on the switch (such as Garchomp or Gallade), investing in Spdef, while not as common as the Bold variant, seemed a logical decision to me. 

Re Gliscor: everyone suggested to go for an Impish nature, and I can definitely see why. I chose Jolly with 140 Speed EV to outspeed everything up to Jolly Gallade with max speed investment (1v1, if I scout for Ice punch with Protect, I would be able to beat him this way). 

 

As you noted, this team composition has some issues:

- Physical attackers that can use both Ice and Fight coverage moves are hard to deal with. Conkeldurr is the most obvious example: burning him with Rotom would be of no use, and it can potentially OHKO both Empoleon and Gliscor depending on the set he uses. This brought me to use Aerial Ace on Scizor, since with CB he can reliably kill non Bulk Up variants

- I cannot provide a really solid answer to strong Fire STAB Physical attackers as well (Darmanitan and Infernape) 

- Gyarados with Power Whip can potentially snowball through my team. I thought about using Rindo Berry instead of Leftovers on Rotom for this reason

 

 

I've read some very useful tips that gave me some food of thought:

- I could try to use Rocks on Gliscor and Defog on Rotom. I would find myself more opportunities to set hazards this way, also I could put Roar on Empoleon instead of Defog; this would however come at the cost of losing Pain Split on Rotom as a way to recover HP (I always love to pain split against pink blobs switching on my Rotom to regain almost full HP)

- Using Leftovers instead of LO on Reuniclus could be very interesting and I could see myself trying that. I originally chose LO because having more damage output from the beginning is sometimes more useful; it's not easy to find chances to setup given the abundance of Dark mons in this meta

- Pursuit on Weavile would net me some more useful kills for sure. Without Low Kick, however, I miss the possibility of trying to surprise kill TTar or other Fighting weak mons (like Empoleon) on the switch. What would you think is better to give up for Pursuit: Night Slash or Low Kick?

- I agree that having 2 Banded mons in the team is potentially very dangerous. Weavile has proved itself invaluable so far, I just find it very good in the current metagame. I would like to replace Scizor with something else... I Really like Dragonite, not sure if having another 4x Ice Weakness is of any good for my team tho.

 

 

After I went into detail on some of my choices and my thought process, I'd love to hear more feedback from you to improve the team.

Thanks!

I mean you can play whatever you want as long as is fun for you!!

If you don't want to swap mons/moves/natures/evs don't do it, is your team after all 🙂

 

But I suggest that you have in mind what is the goal of your team, every team try to win in some way, thats what gave the name to stall/balance/bulky offense etc.

 

For balance from this guide:

Balance
As the name states, this playstyle can be either played aggressive or defensive based on the matchup. It includes ways to beat stall, as well as the defensive utility to outlive Offense. Hazard control is very important for these teams, as they will switch a lot. A good defensive core is very important for balanced teams, as they have to compress as many roles as possible.

 

You don't have a good defensive core (gliscor with jolly nature and 140 evs in speed is not going to do the trick) and lack a way to prevent the enemy to setup on your pasive mons..

Also neither Weavile nor Scizor are going to pierce trought heavy stall.

 

I would pick one good core or 1-2 pokemon that you really want and build from that having in mind a game plan..

[Aleventinove]

9 hours ago, Ramallero said:

I mean you can play whatever you want as long as is fun for you!!

If you don't want to swap mons/moves/natures/evs don't do it, is your team after all 🙂

 

But I suggest that you have in mind what is the goal of your team, every team try to win in some way, thats what gave the name to stall/balance/bulky offense etc.

 

For balance from this guide:

Balance
As the name states, this playstyle can be either played aggressive or defensive based on the matchup. It includes ways to beat stall, as well as the defensive utility to outlive Offense. Hazard control is very important for these teams, as they will switch a lot. A good defensive core is very important for balanced teams, as they have to compress as many roles as possible.

 

You don't have a good defensive core (gliscor with jolly nature and 140 evs in speed is not going to do the trick) and lack a way to prevent the enemy to setup on your pasive mons..

Also neither Weavile nor Scizor are going to pierce trought heavy stall.

 

I would pick one good core or 1-2 pokemon that you really want and build from that having in mind a game plan..

 

Of course it is my team and, ultimately, the choice of its composition is up to me. However, your feedback so far has been very useful and got me thinking about its weaknesses...So, even though I'm probably not gonna use a Chansey as you previously suggested, I appreciate the time you took to answer!

 

What about this:

- Shift Gliscor to an Impish nature and a bulkier build. Earthquake, U-Turn, Protect, Stealth Rock

- Shift Rotom to a Bold nature and Def investment. Hydro Pump, WoW, Volt Switch, Defog.

- Switch Scizor for and Adamant Dragon Dance Dragonite (so, I would keep CB Weavile, maybe changing Night Slash to Pursuit?)

- Switch Empoleon for... Tentacruel. I've used it in the past with good results and has good synergy with Gliscor and Dragonite. Maybe Jolly Nature, with full HP and mixed defenses investment. Liquid Ooze ability. Scald, Toxic, Protect/Haze, Rapid Spin

[Ramallero]

8 hours ago, Aleventinove said:

 

Of course it is my team and, ultimately, the choice of its composition is up to me. However, your feedback so far has been very useful and got me thinking about its weaknesses...So, even though I'm probably not gonna use a Chansey as you previously suggested, I appreciate the time you took to answer!

 

What about this:

- Shift Gliscor to an Impish nature and a bulkier build. Earthquake, U-Turn, Protect, Stealth Rock

- Shift Rotom to a Bold nature and Def investment. Hydro Pump, WoW, Volt Switch, Defog.

- Switch Scizor for and Adamant Dragon Dance Dragonite (so, I would keep CB Weavile, maybe changing Night Slash to Pursuit?)

- Switch Empoleon for... Tentacruel. I've used it in the past with good results and has good synergy with Gliscor and Dragonite. Maybe Jolly Nature, with full HP and mixed defenses investment. Liquid Ooze ability. Scald, Toxic, Protect/Haze, Rapid Spin

I think that Bold Rotom full invested in hp/def + Impish Gliscor could handle physical attackers pretty well (and Reuni solves the Conkeldure issue)..

 

For the special wall Calm Empoleon with Roar/Roost is solid right now (so you don't have to change a lot of your original team) altough Tentacruel sounds good, having rapid spin to remove hazzards without blow away yours aswell is solid. Jolly lowers special attack so Timid would be better, or Calm to go full s.def. Maybe Toxic Spikes? Also Rain Dish could be really good against rain teams.

 

A good game plan would be:

-Pivot around with your walls trying to win the hazzards war and chipping away your enemy.

-Remove the possible answers that your opponent could have to Dragonite.

-Setup with Dragon Dance and clean

-Weaville works well as a pursuit trapper, revenge killer or even a late game cleaner depending on the situation

 

 

 

Edit: one thing I forgot to say is that having a slow U-turn on Gliscor is good in many situation because lets you bring another pokemon in a safe way

 

Edited June 11, 2023 by Ramallero

[caioxlive13]

On 6/9/2023 at 4:32 PM, DiosSlurpuff said:

Like basically any type of equipment in high ladder... The nerf in pp only makes be careful of that, the game mode did not change

Before even if you play one or two bad moves with balanced, you could still win. Now, even the weakest bad move can cost the game.

[DiosSlurpuff]

32 minutes ago, caioxlive13 said:

Before even if you play one or two bad moves with balanced, you could still win. Now, even the weakest bad move can cost the game.

What can be fixed with something as simple as playing well... The post is from a new player asking for advice for his team, what's the point of discussing this here?

[needhelppls]

On 6/9/2023 at 6:48 PM, Ramallero said:

First of all congratulations for the Shiny Reuni!!!!!

I share a lot of the suggestions made by DiosSlurpuff, like the Impish nature on Gliscor and the bold one on Rotom.

This is a team I made trying to keep most of your pokemon:

https://pokepast.es/48df03000f0d1f46

-Chansey to give you a Special Wall (with teleport to pivot around) and Toxic to cripple the enemy foes (but T.Wave or aromateraphy also could be use)
-Dragonite because (in my opinion) every balanced team should have a setup sweeper, and Dragonite is just so good right now with Dragon Claws / Fire Punch giving almost perfect coverage, and extreme speed making him almost imposible to revenge kill (focus sash revenge killers like Weavile can be managed with Stealth Rock).
Lum berry to prevent T.wave / WoW cripple but you could use leftovers (specially if go with Aromateraphy on Chansey).
-The set in Reuniclus is fine but leftovers is much better, life orb works well with Modest nature and 3 attacks.
-I use Pursuit on Scizor to trap Starmie and low hp pokemon (but if you prefer a.a. go ahead).
-I prefer defog on Rotom and Rocks on Gliscor

Is not a perfect team, but has a solid defensive core with some offensive threats that is the purpose of balanced teams 🙂

hi ramallero ive been trying alot to make a pvp team and have ended up with this team in the link but with an empoleon instead of the rotom w with scald ice beam roost roar and calm nature 252 hp 252 spdef and 6 speed is this alright or is it better to have rotom wash.also can i run heal bell on chansey instaed of seismic toss? ur help would be rlly appreciated thx bro

[Ramallero]

23 minutes ago, needhelppls said:

hi ramallero ive been trying alot to make a pvp team and have ended up with this team in the link but with an empoleon instead of the rotom w with scald ice beam roost roar and calm nature 252 hp 252 spdef and 6 speed is this alright or is it better to have rotom wash.also can i run heal bell on chansey instaed of seismic toss? ur help would be rlly appreciated thx bro

Hello! That team was made as an example keeping most of the mons of OP possible. Is far from perfect so feel free to do as many changes as you want 🙂

Some considerations:

-You probably want to give Empoleon defog to have some sort of hazzards control

-For sure you can go hell bell Chansey, I personally never run her with out seis toss cause I feel is too pasive, maybe get rid of teleport instead?

-Leftovers on Dragonite would be better if you have heal bell on Chansey

 

good luck!

[needhelppls]

On 7/17/2023 at 7:05 PM, Ramallero said:

Hello! That team was made as an example keeping most of the mons of OP possible. Is far from perfect so feel free to do as many changes as you want 🙂

Some considerations:

-You probably want to give Empoleon defog to have some sort of hazzards control

-For sure you can go hell bell Chansey, I personally never run her with out seis toss cause I feel is too pasive, maybe get rid of teleport instead?

-Leftovers on Dragonite would be better if you have heal bell on Chansey

 

good luck!

thx bro but tbh if u think the teams far from perfect then idm changing it as the only mon i have ready made was gliscor with 252 hp and defense impish stealth rock eq roost and protect.

id honestly love to see a team from a more experienced player as im new and want to enjoy the game whilst also winning so what would u recommend for me?.I rlly appreciate responses for help so thank u so much my brother

Edited July 19, 2023 by needhelppls