Imperial

That banner is absolutely stunning

I thought I'd make one final comment here alongside on Discord, I would propose the following solutions: Increase the usage % to around 4.8-5% - even increasing it slightly will see a massive difference in the number of mons yo-yo-ing from UU and NU Consider tournament usage from quarterfinals onwards UU Salamence - quickban (offensive uber) Porygon2 - ban (offensive/defensive uber) Milotic - nothing but this thing will be a huge pain in the ass Jolteon - pressures offensive teams a lot but let's give this a chance NU Nidoqueen - quickban (offensive uber) Cloyster - suspect test Zoroark - this will be strong but I think we have the tools to cope with it and we had it in NU before (I think without Gigalith in the tier) - this is fine I think a thread should be created for Cloyster and a vote placed on Nidoqueen and Salamence as soon as possible. Edit - I believe that Sharpedo should be banned or at the minimum a thread be created. I think there is enough evidence that every set poses a huge threat to a large number of mons in the tier. I was wrong about Scrafty, this is fine. Shoutout to @PoseidonWrath for being the most transparent TC member, I'm sure you all do a great job but it would be nice to have more members be transparent about their discussions with us so we can help deliver our input if needed.

I agree with what you've said, the usage system is completely flawed for the lower tiers and I'll repeat myself and state that I really hope they implement either a slightly increased usage % or include tournament usage as well (a much better indicator). I've spotted that pattern of things yo-yo-ing between NU and UU and that's annoyed me personally, good examples include Slowbro, Druddigon, Tentacruel and Gligar. Hopefully the above solution can be considered sooner rather than later. Honestly going forwards I can see UU and NU becoming heavily stall favoured with the number of defensive mons being into the tier, I really hope I'm proved wrong because OU has already become so boring and it's only going to potentially get worse with some of the new HAs and gen 9 movesets coming out.

Thank you, it would be great if Tier Council can also consider Nidoqueen's offensive set in the tier. I had initial concerns about Cloyster but I feel this will probably be fine.

Crawdaunt is centralising but we still have Shaymin, Poliwrath and potentially Salamence(?) - my concerns about the latter below: @Munya - Please could you request that Tier Council take a look into Salamence? The initial suspect test never came to a conclusion because it automatically went to OU once it gained its Hidden Ability but now it will drop down based on usage. There's the argument that there are decent checks for it, but it still pressures offensive teams massively with its speed (speed ties with Shaymin and both can self-recover admittedly although Salamence has a far superior typing), versatile sets (DD + mixed) and Moxie, and with Porygon2 potentially being banned and Mamoswine no longer being in the tier when the initial discussion was made, I believe there should be a new suspect test at the minimum or a quickban if many people already feel the same about this. P.S. Please don't say that Jolteon is the answer to keeping this at bay.

What are Tier Council's initial thoughts on the following Pokemon coming down to NU? Cloyster - 3.58% Usage in UU Nidoqueen - 3.70% Usage in UU I'm concerned about Nidoqueen's offensive set in the tier with its decent bulk. Tentacruel, Gastrodon and Vaporeon dropping down will make some interesting team cores and possibly favour a more defensive meta, Sceptile's usage will likely be high as it heavily pressures all of these alongside AV Eelektross being great. I also remember Salamence was being suspect tested in UU at the time but it was automatically placed in OU because it had Moxie. Can TC confirm their stance on this and if the suspect test ended or if a vote will take place? (Mamoswine is no longer in the tier)

Unless I misunderstood your comment, removing Crawdaunt and Shaymin does not solve the underlying issue with Porygon2 - it can switch into almost any offensive Pokemon which isn't a fighting type, most offensive mons are unable to freely switch into porygon2 without taking serious damage/risk of RNG. It can pivot out to regain momentum if needed and it's incredibly bulky overall so it fits into most/every teambuild. When Porygon2 was first introduced, most people were forced to run Gigalith/Empoleon/Dusclops in their teams. Defensive teams can handle p2, but for what it was initially designed to do defensively it's incredibly restricting for offensive gameplay, and that should not be the case for a 'defensive' mon. I will emphasise my above comment in response to what you said here: Porygon2 is not affecting how long matches are, it's restricting offensive gameplay and should be banned as an offensive uber as unlike Porygon-Z, it carries incredible bulk and can be utilised defensively and offensively. Anyway the duck will likely be rebanned so this conversation is pointless.

Hey there - I've sent you both a private message 🙂

Thank you @KaynineXL for hosting an amazing PSL and letting me create and moderate this thread, and thank you to the other people who helped with being a middleman. 2 people were blacklisted - if someone would like me to create a betting thread for a future tournament I will keep these people on the blacklist, otherwise I will let the next person decide if they want to start with a new list. Mods please lock this thread by the end of the week to give everyone time to pay remaining bets.

Boss Ploegy Incognition Executives/Godfathers Ploegy Onraider PinkWings Powerdrib Commanders/Underboss HALOTT Edstorm Officers/Mafioso Dindra Requi FredfHK spelenn TheBloo Robbinho JustaChamp HEARTEATERS

I agree with the above comments - I love the Pokemon but Porygon2 should be banned from the tier. First off, this is a Pokemon that can make any teambuild look way better than it is, especially more offensive teams as it can sponge hits from several mons, return hefty damage in return with the modest download set and also pivot out safely if needed. Secondly, this thing still heavily restricts offensive play as many/most offensive mons can't switch into it (haven't calculated stuff like AV Machamp but Tri Attack can do 35-40% to Bisharp), not to mention the risk of being haxxed/RNG to death by Tri Attack spam (I've seen so many freezes when spectating UU matches). The main stuff I believe can reliably check this are: Porygon2 (lol) Dusclops Gigalith Umbreon Spiritomb(?) Bronzong Snorlax Rhyperior (AV set?) Empoleon (depends on chip damage & thunderbolt) Most of these can't do anything in return, except for possibly poisoning it which may or may not make a huge difference. As for Shaymin, this is definitely A or S tier right now - the 40% special defense drop is annoying with Seed Flare and it has fantastic move coverage to restrict many offensive mons from switching in, but personally I'm not sure if this is banworthy yet, I'd rather wait to see what happens when p2 gets banned which should definitely take priority. P.S. As always happy to provide calcs if needed to justify my opinion.

Yes sure, done. If someone else creates/moderates the next betting thread I won't be able to have the final say, but happy to keep him blacklisted when I create one again.

@PoseidonWrath

Money has been sent to @Lunarck Thank you for using me as middleman.

@PKTxKharma won the bet - the money has been sent to him. Thank you both for using me as the middleman.