[Documentation] Red Fight Post Update

[Aizeilon]

Hi all again. They really messed with Red fight strats huh? Lol

 

I once again turn to the forums in hope to find all the new information about Red -- What's been changed, what's the same, what are the new teams, etc.

 

Here's what I know: [UPDATED NOV 23RD '23]

-Each team is themed around one of the 5 regions.
-Pokemon Species and Item clause has been added. No same items, no same pokemon species (ex: no Jolteon and Vaporeon on the same comp).

-Red now "intimidates" all pokemon below lvl 50. Baby strats are dead.

-Red follows a similar team structure to gyms, where he has 1 pokemon consistent across all teams (Pikachu). Pika's moveset is different depending on the team you get.

-Red will use Every starter from every region. All of them have HA except 5 (Meganium, Sceptile, Blaziken, Swampert, Samurott).

-Kanto and Unova teams have random leads, Johto, Hoenn, and Sinnoh teams have consistent leads. (Thank you caav for confirming)

 

With that, here's the teams. I'll update them as I get more information.

 

Kanto Team:

Identical to original Red team

• Espeon
  • T1M: Wish
  • Life Orb
  • Magic Bounce
  • Psyshock, Shadow Ball, Weather Ball, Power Gem
• Snorlax
  • T1M: Reflect
  • Leftovers
  • Immunity
  • Body Slam, Earthquake, Rest, Sleep Talk
• Venusaur
  • T1M: Light Screen
  • Grass Gem
  • Chlorophyll
  • Giga Drain, Sludge Bomb, Earth Power, Weather Ball
• Charizard
  • T1M: Sunny Day
  • Expert Belt
  • Solar Power
  • Flamethrower, Dragon Pulse, Focus Blast, Air Slash
• Blastoise
  • T1M: Rain Dance
  • Choice Scarf
  • Rain Dish
  • Water Spout, Ice Beam, Hidden Power Grass, Surf
• Pikachu
  • Ability and Item (Lightning Rod, Light Ball) consistent across all teams. Will not reiterate
  • T1M: Nasty Plot
  • Thunder, Volt Switch, Grass Knot, Hidden Power Ice

 

Johto Team:

• Gliscor (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Toxic Orb
  • Poison Heal
  • Earthquake, U-Turn, Facade, Roost
• Tyranitar
  • T1M: Thunder Wave 
  • Expert Belt
  • Sand Stream
  • Earthquake, Crunch, Ice Punch, Rock Slide
• Meganium
  • T1M: Light Screen
  • Leftovers
  • Overgrow
  • Giga Drain, Dragon Tail, Leech Seed, Toxic
• Typhlosion
  • T1M: Work Up
  • Choice Scarf
  • Flash Fire
  • Shadow Ball, Eruption, Wild Charge, Hidden Power (Grass?)
• Feraligatr
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • Life Orb
  • Sheer Force
  • Waterfall, Ice Punch, Crunch, Body Slam
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Agility
  • Moves: Volt Switch, Volt Tackle, Brick Break, Hidden Power Ice

 

Hoenn Team:

• Metagross
  • T1M: Block
  • Clear Body
  • Chesto Berry
  • Meteor Mash, Ice Punch, Earthquake, Rest
• Salamence
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • Moxie
  • Yache Berry (weakens Ice)
  • Dragon Claw, Earthquake, Aqua Tail, Fire Fang
• Sceptile
  • T1M: Subsitute
  • Overgrow
  • Expert Belt
  • Giga Drain, Earthquake, Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power Fire
• Blaziken
  • T1M: Agility
  • Blaze
  • Life Orb
  • Close Combat, Flare Blitz, Thunder Punch, Hidden Power Ice
• Marshtomp (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Torrent
  • Leftovers
  • Scald, Earthquake, Ice Punch, Toxic
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Charge
  • Volt Switch, Volt Tackle, Hidden Power Ice, Extreme Speed

 

Sinnoh Team:

• Staraptor (Lead)
  • T1M: Whirlwind
  • Reckless
  • Life Orb
  • Close Combat, Brave Bird, Double Edge, ???
    • Extra Info
      • Jolly Nature + Max Speed. Spd Stat: 328
• Garchomp
  • T1M: Hone Claws
  • Rough Skin
  • Haban Berry
  • Earthquake, Stone Edge, Dragon Rush, Fire Blast
• Torterra
  • T1M: Reflect
  • Shell Armor
  • Assault Gear 
  • Earthquake, Stone Edge, Crunch, Leaf Blade
• Infernape
  • T1M: Swords Dance
  • Iron Fist
  • Focus Sash
  • Close Combat, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, U-Turn
• Empoleon
  • T1M: Defog
  • Competitive
  • Leftovers
  • Hydro Pump, Ice Beam, Toxic, Roost
    • Bonus Info:
      • 157 Spd (4 Spd EVs, nature unmodifying)
      • Lower Sp. Atk than you think
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Substitute
  • Thunderbolt, Grass Knot, Focus Punch, Hidden Power Ice

 

Unova Team:

• Excadrill
  • T1M: Sandstorm
  • Sand Rush
  • Life Orb
  • Earthquake, Iron Head, X-Scissor, Rock Slide
• Hydreigon
  • T1M: Defog
  • Levitate
  • Dragon Gem
  • Draco Meteor, Fire Blast, Focus Blast, U-Turn
• Serperior
  • T1M: Substitute
  • Contrary
  • Leftovers
  • Leaf Storm, Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power Fire, Leech Seed
• Emboar (Lead)
  • T1M: Roar
  • Reckless
  • Fire Gem
  • Flare Blitz, Superpower, Sucker Punch, Wild Charge
• Samurott
  • T1M: Block
  • Torrent
  • Expert Belt
  • Ice Beam, Surf, Grass Knot, Hidden Power (Grass?)
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Nasty Plot
  • Thunderbolt, Volt Switch, Grass Knot, Hidden Power Ice

 

Thank you for any and all help on this documentation!

Contributors:

-Kanto: -- (see bottom)

-Johto: Myself

-Hoenn: Raptorheart (reddit), Zergy, gbwead

-Sinnoh: Yubothy, Myself, Cheemsito, jonlee214 (reddit), Sk1tt3n (reddit)

-Unova: ShadowTrainerr, flyingpiggies (reddit), 

-Special Note to secretgg, who's doing his own list, and caav for making me aware of it. Information has been cross-traded.

Edited November 23, 2023 by Aizeilon
New EVs/Nature info, Garchomp finally revealed Fire Blast

[Aonyx]

Red's Garchomp has a haban berry

 

[kenjimAd]

Red has Unova Pokémons,Moves & Held Items Revealed!

Hydreigon - Held Item: Dragon Gem -  Draco Meteor

Emboar - Superpower

Samurott - Surf

Serperior - Hidden Power (Fire) & Leech Seed

Excadrill - Held Item: Life Orb -  Earthquake & Iron Head

 

Edited October 26, 2023 by kenjimAd

[Sawwario]

Hoenn team always lead with Marshtomp first, that happens to have earthquake and scald (idk the rest)

[Zergy09]

Hoenn Team:

• Metagross
  • T1M: Block
  • Clear Body
  • Chesto Berry
  • Meteor Mash, Ice Punch, Earthquake, Rest
• Salamence
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • Moxie
  • Yache Berry
  • Dragon Claw, Earthquake, Aqua Tail, Fire Fang
• Sceptile
  • T1M: Substitute
  • Overgrow, Not Unburden (wtf devs)
  • Expert Belt
  • Giga Drain, Earthquake, Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power Fire
• Blaziken
  • T1M: Agility
  • Blaze
  • Life Orb
  • Close Combat, Flare Blitz, Thunder Punch, Hidden Power Ice
• Swampert (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Damp/Torrent
  • Leftovers
  • Scald, Eathquake, Ice Punch, Toxic
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Charge
  • Volt Switch, Volt Tackle, Hidden Power Ice, Extreme Speed
    
    
    Notes: Pikachu moves may change depending on the team, the hoenn version has Extreme Speed

 

 

 

Edited October 27, 2023 by Zergy09

[Laomir]

Having played my match against Red this morning (last week: team Unova ).

I came across the same team that he has as base for kanto: Pikachu/ all starters kanto / espeon and snorlax.

[Aonyx]

Here is how I beat the sinnoh team:

 

 

[NullBit]

what means T1M?

[Zergy09]

41 minutes ago, NullBit said:

what means T1M?

turn one move, i think

[gbwead]

On 10/19/2023 at 11:01 PM, Aizeilon said:

Johto Team:

• Gliscor (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Toxic Orb
  • Poison Heal
  • Earthquake, Roost
• Tyranitar
  • T1M: Thunder Wave 
  • ???
  • Sand Stream
  • Earthquake
• Meganium
  • T1M: Light Screen
  • Leftovers
  • Leaf guard?
  • Giga Drain
• Typhlosion
  • T1M: Work Up
  • Choice Scarf
  • Flash Fire?
  • Shadow Ball
• Feraligatr
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • ??? (potentially choice band)
  • Sheer Force
  • Waterfall
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Agility
  • All else same

I saw Ice Punch on TTar, Ice Punch on Feraligatr, U-Turn on Gliscor and Leech Seed on Meganium.

[caioxlive13]

On 10/20/2023 at 12:01 AM, Aizeilon said:

Hi all again. They really messed with Red fight strats huh? Lol

 

I once again turn to the forums in hope to find all the new information about Red -- What's been changed, what's the same, what are the new teams, etc.

 

Here's what I know so far:

-Each team is themed around one of the 5 regions.
-Pokemon and Item clause has been added. No same items, no same pokemon.

-Red now "intimidates" all pokemon below lvl 50. Baby strats are dead.

-At least 1 team has a Focus sash mon. Wobuffet strats are probably dead.

-EVERY TEAM probably has Pikachu, if the pattern I've seen is true. Pikachu also will have the exact same moveset (Thunder, Volt Switch, Grass Knot, HP Ice), but different initial moves (more below)

-Red will use Every starter from every region. All of them have HA (Expect Blaziken bc Speed Boost).

-LEADS ARE CONSISTENT, if the fact a friend of mine got Staraptor 9 times in a row is anything to go off of.

 

With that, here's the teams. I'll update them as I get more information.

 

Kanto Team:

Same? (Needs confirmation)

 

Johto Team:

• Gliscor (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Toxic Orb
  • Poison Heal
  • Earthquake, Roost
• Tyranitar
  • T1M: Thunder Wave 
  • ???
  • Sand Stream
  • Earthquake
• Meganium
  • T1M: Light Screen
  • Leftovers
  • Leaf guard?
  • Giga Drain
• Typhlosion
  • T1M: Work Up
  • Choice Scarf
  • Flash Fire?
  • Shadow Ball
• Feraligatr
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • ??? (potentially choice band)
  • Sheer Force
  • Waterfall
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Agility
  • All else same

 

Hoenn Team:

• Metagross
  • T1M: Block
  • Clear Body
  • ???
  • ???
• Salamence
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • Intimidate/Moxie (unknown which)
  • ???
  • ???
• Sceptile
  • T1M: ???
  • Unburden
  • ??? (likely a gem)
  • ???
• Blaziken
  • T1M: Agility
  • Blaze
  • ???
  • ???
• Marshtomp (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Damp
  • ???
  • ???
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Charge
  • All else the same

 

Sinnoh Team:

• Staraptor (Lead)
  • T1M: Whirlwind
  • Reckless
  • Life Orb
  • Close Combat, Brave Bird, Double Edge
• Garchomp
  • T1M: Hone Claws
  • Rough Skin
  • ??? (Not Choice)
  • Earthquake, Stone Edge, Dragon Rush
• Torterra
  • T1M: Reflect
  • Shell Armor
  • ??? 
  • Earthquake, Stone Edge, Crunch, Leaf Blade
• Infernape
  • T1M: Swords Dance
  • Iron Fist
  • Focus Sash
  • Close Combat, Thunder Punch
• Empoleon
  • T1M: Defog
  • Competitive?
  • Leftovers
  • Hydro Pump
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Substitute
  • Other stuff unchanged

 

Unova Team:

• Excadrill
  • T1M: Sandstorm
  • Sand Force/Sand Rush (undetermined which)
  • ???
  • ???
• Hydreigon
  • T1M: Defog
  • Levitate
  • ???
  • ???
• Serperior
  • T1M: Substitute
  • Contrary
  • Leftovers
  • Leaf Storm, Dragon Pulse
• Emboar (Lead)
  • T1M: Roar
  • Reckless
  • Fire Gem
  • Flare Blitz
• Samurott
  • T1M: Block
  • Sharpness
  • ???
  • Ice Beam
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Nasty Plot
  • Other stuff, unchanged

 

Thank you for any and all help on this documentation!

Contributors:

-Kanto: --

-Johto: Myself

-Hoenn: Raptorheart (reddit)

-Sinnoh: Yubothy, Myself

-Unova: ShadowTrainerr

Pikachu probabbly has Light Ball as a item. Anything else doesn't make sense to him. Also, for Salamence on Hoeen team, check if Intimidate triggers upon switch-in. If yes, then it's intimidate. If not, then it's moxie. 

[Cheemsito]

Johto: Gliscor has Facade, Feraligatr has Body Slam, Typhlosion has HP Ice, Tyranitar has Rock Slide

 

Hoenn: Swampert has Ice Punch

 

Sinnoh: Empoleon has Roost, Toxic and Ice Beam

 

Unova: Hydreigon has U-Turn and Focus Blast, Excadrill has X-Scizor and Rock Slide, Samurott has Grass Knot and HP... Electric?

[Aizeilon]

Wow this got traction today didn't it? Lol

To update those who see this, a LOT more information was found thanks to me crossposting on Reddit. Especially with the Hoenn team @Zergy09 posted (huge thanks for this, Hoenn was the gen I was missing a lot of info on), I should be able to update this to be almost fully complete sometime before the end of the weekend.

And of course, Im working on counterplay too lol

And Zergy, if you see this, mind confirming your in game name? I was giving my guildmates a bounty for massive updates like what you've been able to provide, so it feels only fair I reward you like them 🙂

 

Thank you everyone else who also has hopped in to contibute! I wish I could thank you all in a similar fashion but gaddam is it hard to organize all this info lol

[Zergy09]

5 hours ago, Aizeilon said:

Wow this got traction today didn't it? Lol

To update those who see this, a LOT more information was found thanks to me crossposting on Reddit. Especially with the Hoenn team @Zergy09 posted (huge thanks for this, Hoenn was the gen I was missing a lot of info on), I should be able to update this to be almost fully complete sometime before the end of the weekend.

And of course, Im working on counterplay too lol

And Zergy, if you see this, mind confirming your in game name? I was giving my guildmates a bounty for massive updates like what you've been able to provide, so it feels only fair I reward you like them 🙂

 

Thank you everyone else who also has hopped in to contibute! I wish I could thank you all in a similar fashion but gaddam is it hard to organize all this info lol

ur welcome 🧡
game name is Zergy

 

[XanarchyNL]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRYCLNn-KgtvWxcgVZZH77r75YdVRfth7ZnIE3QiuGoWD1fEYuAnx8nkgwuUDUWtPMeQfG7qBfjzE4d/pubhtml?gid=849575436&single=true 

[Zergy09]

On 10/26/2023 at 9:06 AM, Zergy09 said:

Hoenn Team:

• Metagross
  • T1M: Block
  • Clear Body
  • Chesto Berry
  • Meteor Mash, Ice Punch, Earthquake, Rest
• Salamence
  • T1M: Dragon Dance
  • Moxie
  • Yache Berry
  • Dragon Claw, Earthquake, Aqua Tail, Fire Fang
• Sceptile
  • T1M: Substitute
  • Overgrow, Not Unburden (wtf devs)
  • Expert Belt
  • Giga Drain, Earthquake, Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power Fire
• Blaziken
  • T1M: Agility
  • Blaze
  • Life Orb
  • Close Combat, Flare Blitz, Thunder Punch, Hidden Power Ice, 
• Swampert (Lead)
  • T1M: Stealth Rock
  • Damp/Torrent
  • Leftovers
  • Scald, Eathquake, Ice Punch, Toxic
• Pikachu
  • T1M: Charge
  • Volt Switch, Hidden Power Ice, Extreme Speed, ???
    
    
    Notes: Pikachu moves may change depending on the team, the hoenn version has Extreme Speed

 

 

 

i updated some movs of the hoenn team, i just need 1 move of pikachu

thanks 🧡 @XanarchyNL for the moves table

[gbwead]

1 minute ago, Zergy09 said:

i updated some movs of the hoenn team, i just need 1 move of pikachu

thanks 🧡 @XanarchyNL for the moves table

Volt Tackle is the last move.

[Zergy09]

1 minute ago, gbwead said:

Volt Tackle is the last move.

are u sure ? i was thinking it was Grass Knot lol, anyways thanks 🧡

[Zergy09]

Made it in showdown because why not

[Aizeilon]

I actually knew about the table above already, or at least it's highly likely the same one. Ty all of you for help with the hoenn team again, I'll update the main post here in a few hours once I compile it all.

In my main Red guide doc, I'll have Showdown tables for your importing convenience too

(I have a Red guide from pre-changes, using those ideas as my base)

[Aizeilon]

Small thing: Staraptor 4th move is unknown, BUT an interesting factoid is that in the Showdown calc, there's a Choice Band Staraptor set with the other 3 moves + U-Turn. Considering U-Turn has shown up in the past, I will note this.

[gbwead]

On 10/19/2023 at 11:01 PM, Aizeilon said:

-Pokemon Species and Item clause has been added. No same items, no same pokemon species (ex: no Jolteon and Vaporeon on the same comp).

Is Pokemon Species clause different in PVE compared to PVP? I'm asking because Jolteon and Vaporeon would be allowed in the same team in PVP.

[Rache]

2 hours ago, gbwead said:

Is Pokemon Species clause different in PVE compared to PVP? I'm asking because Jolteon and Vaporeon would be allowed in the same team in PVP.

PvE boss fights use different species clause rules, preventing you from using multiple from the same evolution line. This limits certain cheese strategies.

[RysPicz]

2 hours ago, Rache said:

PvE boss fights use different species clause rules, preventing you from using multiple from the same evolution line. This limits certain cheese strategies.

Like using 6 Pidgeys to destroy Red? 

[Rache]

10 minutes ago, RysPicz said:

Like using 6 Pidgeys to destroy Red? 

Too powerful, can't allow that.