UU Viability Thread

[Arimanius]

yes if this was a simluator, but idk here cause large amount of bp needed to make a pika, plus the whole complicated breeding method to get volt tackle that messes up current method making it necessary to have 2x god pikas to sacrifice to get one with volt tackle. 
 
and
0 SpA Light Ball Pikachu Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Exeggcute: 114-136 (68.2 - 81.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 SpA Light Ball Pikachu Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Vileplume: 68-82 (37.3 - 45%) -- 68% chance to 2HKO after 3 layers of Spikes and Leftovers recovery
 
mixed pika has a chance if hp ice/fly/fire and if some previous damage, or spikes + high dmg roll for vile, and exeggutor cant stop mixed. also 
 

252+ Atk Light Ball Pikachu Volt Tackle vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Altaria: 102-120 (56 - 65.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Light Ball Pikachu Volt Tackle vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 132-156 (74.5 - 88.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Light Ball Pikachu Volt Tackle vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowking: 218-260 (107.9 - 128.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ Atk Light Ball Pikachu Volt Tackle vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Umbreon: 123-145 (60.8 - 71.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
 
not much that isnt immune/bulky grass can tank the hit.
trike is a danger, but espeed

252+ Atk Light Ball Pikachu ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Manectric: 88-104 (60.6 - 71.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
quag is danger if no hp grass, gligar/queen/donphan(max def) if no ice or surf, tangela/exe/vile if no hp ice/fly/fire, but nothing can counter every move of pikas. 
 
it's the gengar of uu that no one uses cause >bp + breeding system + nyi volt tackle

0 SpA Light Ball Pikachu Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Exeggutor: 88-104 (43.5 - 51.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

You're welcome xD

[gbwead]

Even when Volt Tackle gets implemented, Lanturn will remain a hard counter to Pikachu. HP grass doesn't do much and no HP ice means free space for Plume and Exeggutor.

 

Edit: Pikachu's strength comes from its movepool and Lanturn is an easy scouting option.

Edited August 3, 2015 by lamerb

[Bestfriends]

Here is the Summer Ball Qualifier #5 if anyone needs to refer to it. I not only make tournament videos for entertainment, but I also make them so competitive people can use my tournament video as a source to make the tier better.

 

 

Edited November 24, 2016 by Bestfriends
Updated URL

[OldKeith]

Here is the Summer Ball Qualifier #5 if anyone needs to refer to it. I not only make tournament videos for entertainment, but I also make them so competitive people can use my tournament video as a source to make the tier better.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=9057&v=Jz8pM5oDmC8

 

Nice vid, watched most of it. I have no idea what you did in your absence from pokemmo, but your commentary got much better than he usual.

[Bestfriends]

Nice vid, watched most of it. I have no idea what you did in your absence from pokemmo, but your commentary got much better than he usual.

 

Thanks, I tried to get on the ball as far as new is concerned. I have a newer approach to filming headlines, guides, shops, tournaments, and even interviews! I look forward to broadcasting an interview with some of these tactics! I am also glad to see you coming back to PokeMMO!

[DrCraig]

Chansey has been removed from the list due to the fact that Chansey has been banned to BL.

[Toast]

Soo.. rip porygon2 and umbreon, welcome Rhydon and Dusclops? Imo rhydon will be a really strong poke with sd + sub or CB. Itll be nice to take on swellow though. I could see it going BL?

[DrCraig]

I'll get to updating this by tomorrow hopefully.

[Kizhaz]

Rhydon will last 1 tournament

[DoubleJ]

This will be the first time that UU has really had a quality Will-o-Wisp user (Dusclops) and it will be interesting to see how the tier adapts with our limited number of GUTS users. It will also be interesting to see whether Rhydon can find a place, or if it will simply be just too stronk and require a ban to BL. 

 

Off the top of my head, Claydol, Dusclops, Blastoise, Cradily, and Hitmontop are all pretty decent checks for standard Rhydon sets. Outside of that, Rhydon is easily revenge killed so long as it's not sitting behind a substitute. This means that things like Swellow (w/o Steel Wing) and CB-locked normal spam become set-up bait for the SD version. Could this be the return of Donphan?

 

252 Atk Choice Band Guts Swellow Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rhydon: 87-102 (41 - 48.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

 

If only that did just a tad bit more.

[DrCraig]

Due to the recent changes in the tiers based on usage:

• Porygon2 and Umbreon have been removed from the list; they're now OU.
• Rhydon and Dusclops have been added to the list; they're now UU.

 

It's time now to discuss where you think our new additions will go, and how they will effect the tier. We'll get a more clear picture of what's going on in the near future after some officials so I will wait until then to solidify rankings.

 

Am I also curious. What are your opinions on Alakazam with Chansey, Porygon2 and Umbreon not in UU anymore?

[DoubleJ]

Rhydon - Instant A+, we just don't have the defensive power to stop a +2 Rhydon behind a sub without sacrificing one or two pokes on our team. Looking to Claydol to rise up in usage in order to combat the common SubDanceQuakeSlide set. CB Megahorn might catch a few players by surprise with quality predictions, but honestly, CB EQ is always trouble. 

 

Dusclops - A, it's going to be one of our featured defensive walls that can double on the special side as well. I see very few things that can handle Dusclops w/ WoW so it will be interesting to see how this plays out. We lack quality GUTS users in UU, since Raticate gets pooped on by Rhydon (Oh hello Iron Tail) and Swellow can't touch Dusclops much even after a burn. 

 

Zam at +1 kills Rhydon and can really put the beat down on Dusclops if it has some damage. Zam is an interesting one that should see a bump in usage considering Rhydon hurts Swellow's viability so badly. Another reason though for Zam to get put on the UU ban list look-out. 

[fredrichnietze]

question, besides swellow what is rhydon supposed to be setting up against?

this is not the gen 3 mechanics meta that rhydon was banned form year+ ago. we have physical water/grass/ice now and lots of event/tutor moves like low kick/super power/ice punch running around now.

sure once rhydon sets up it's scary as fuck, and cb rhydon can provide immediate pressure, but it no longer has such a large number of pokemon it can set up upon, and cb set has to take the prediction risk.

it might prove to be too strong, but it's definitely not a sure thing.

[DrCraig]

question, besides swellow what is rhydon supposed to be setting up against?

this is not the gen 3 mechanics meta that rhydon was banned form year+ ago. we have physical water/grass/ice now and lots of event/tutor moves like low kick/super power/ice punch running around now.

sure once rhydon sets up it's scary as fuck, and cb rhydon can provide immediate pressure, but it no longer has such a large number of pokemon it can set up upon, and cb set has to take the prediction risk.

it might prove to be too strong, but it's definitely not a sure thing.

Yea that's the view I see it from. Rhydon is strong as fuck and really has no reliabley counters that were common previously, but it really doesn't have much room to come in. Plume, Scizor and Slowking make up the most common core honestly and they give Rhydon no room. Even if it snuck in on a double switch, odds are its not safely going to plow.

 

Here's some top usage pokemon, and the vast majority of them carry moves which put significant dents in Rhydon. Some are even faster than Rhydon too.

 

Rhydon might seem bad on paper with its opportunities to come in, but I still think it will be a huge force and I'm excited to see it in action at an official.

 

I'm banking on Rhydon being broken though. :P

 

Note: Yea I know the usage from Umby/P2 days, but shut up, those pokemon will still be common and you know it.

Edited August 8, 2015 by DrCraig

[gbwead]

I doub't Rhydon will be broken, but like JJ said the combination of Zam + Rhydon is quite ugly.

 

On another note, all the scizor out there that refuse to run steelwings, you will make dusclops really happy. 

[Sashaolin]

Rhydon Adamant CB with Earthquake - Megahorn - Crunch - Double Edge 2HKO every UU/NU except Impish Donphan, who else ?

[Gunthug]

Rhydon Adamant CB with Earthquake - Megahorn - Crunch - Double Edge 2HKO every UU/NU except Impish Donphan, who else ?

You forgot a pretty important move

E: I agree with your premise though - but a defensive core can handle cb rhydon with some scouting. Gligar/steelix can pivot through that set Edited August 8, 2015 by Gunthug

[NikhilR]

Hmm, I get that Rhydon is a friggin beast and that it will most likely be banned, but in our current meta, what can it safely switch in vs? May be a wish clefable I suppose and Kanga if it isn't carrying EQ. 

 

I assume ppl might stop running Swellow, out of fear of letting Rhydon set up. 

Edited August 8, 2015 by NikhilR

[gbwead]

Rhydon Adamant CB with Earthquake - Megahorn - Crunch - Double Edge 2HKO every UU/NU except Impish Donphan, who else ?

Breloom impish

[Toast]

rhydon doesnt get crunch lol, but i've played a few battles to try out rhydon, and i do agree it is really hard to switch it in (never even got to use it :'( )

[BurntZebra]

question, besides swellow what is rhydon supposed to be setting up against?

this is not the gen 3 mechanics meta that rhydon was banned form year+ ago. we have physical water/grass/ice now and lots of event/tutor moves like low kick/super power/ice punch running around now.

sure once rhydon sets up it's scary as fuck, and cb rhydon can provide immediate pressure, but it no longer has such a large number of pokemon it can set up upon, and cb set has to take the prediction risk.

it might prove to be too strong, but it's definitely not a sure thing.

Well now that porygon and umbreon were moved up, one of the only viable special walls left is kangaskhan, which can't do a whole lot vs rhydon, with its typical normal/fire/possibly dark coverage. Hypno doesn't really fare too well vs rhydon either.

 

edit:

 

rhydon pretty much gets all viable physical moves. megahorn double edge earthquake rock slide superpower ice punch fire punch thunderpunch 

 

And rhydon does get crunch, at least it should since its a gen 6 egg move for it, but I don't know why you'd run crunch since rock slide hits ghosts plenty hard and megahorn ohkos psychic types

Edited August 8, 2015 by BurntZebra

[Sashaolin]

Breloom impish

 

252+ Atk Choice Band Rhydon Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Breloom: 94-111 (56.2 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

Edit : nvm for crunch

Edited August 8, 2015 by Sashaolin

[gbwead]

 

252+ Atk Choice Band Rhydon Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Breloom: 94-111 (56.2 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

Edit : nvm for crunch

 

Choice band scouted, no casualties: mission accomplished XD

[Toast]

oh shit, yeah my bad, i missed crunch on the pokedex while looking for it, but tbh EQ/DE is basically unresisted coverage

[DoubleJ]

And EQ/DE are probably the two worst moves to get CB locked into.