Full box trading

[Poratne]

The past few weeks, even months I've noticed an increase in scams regarding Ditto boxes. 
I've also been scammed a couple of times now, but a few days ago this was the reply given to me. 

The same reply has been given to many of my friends, teammates and others. 

Where as I try to understand where they're coming from as SGM+ etc. and that these types of reports take up a lot of time for them. I feel like for long-term the "Pay X amount for 5 dittos" is very inconvenient and wont get rid of all scams regarding these type of transactions, cause majority will still pay full price upfront. 

Refusing to restore money that has been scammed in the future too will make people not want to report them anymore, cause whats the gain of them reporting if they wont get their money back. It's a give and take situation.

I can see these type of scams being resolved by adding a feature where we can trade FULL boxes only for X amount of $. 
 

[Servor5555]

Exactly this. It's gonna be some time until everyone (or most people) go back to paying the full price on first trade, like most people do currently. And it's not because they are exactly "looking" to get scammed. But because it saves time on what's already a lenghty (and to be honest, an inconvenient) process (particulary if there are multiple boxes)

I can understand what are they trying to convey with this, having dozens (possibly hundreds) of cases of Ditto box scamming weekly and only a few staffs to review them isn't feasible at all, especially if we also add the other types of reports. But it needs to be understand that they aren't doing any favours to the community with this, and it isn't the most welcomed way to approach it, which can be solved (as the post is suggesting) with something like a whole box trading. This idea would fully eliminate Ditto scams while also making it more convenient (and faster) for both parties involved

[Doctor]

I too understand the message and the reasons behind it, but pretty much blaming the scammed, no matter how many similar cases there are, seems a bit rude, to say the least.

 

Refusing to help someone who's been scammed for doing something that's been done like this (because we lack a better method of doing it, and no, sending the money per trade is anything but comfortable when you're trading 5+ boxes at once unless you wanna spend your evening staring at the PC) for well over 5 years is crazy, what is this supposed to be? A disciplinary punishment? So people learn to... not be scammed?

Edited December 28, 2023 by Doctor

[Servor5555]

On 12/28/2023 at 2:40 PM, Doctor said:

I too understand the message and the reasons behind it, but pretty much blaming the scammed, no matter how many similar cases there are, seems a bit rude, to say the least.

 

Refusing to help someone who's been scammed for doing something that's been done like this (because we lack a better method of doing it, and no, sending the money per trade is anything but comfortable when you're trading 5+ boxes at once unless you wanna spend your evening staring at the PC) for well over 5 years is crazy, what is this supposed to be? A disciplinary punishment? So people learn to... not be scammed?

I do kinda agree with your opinion, telling the buyer/victim to "refuse to give the money back" because it unwittingly trusted to someone who undoubtedly and KNOWINGLY acted in malicious intent from the very first moment doesn't sound right with me, but that's beside the point.

As you were saying this method has been done for well over 5 years now, in that time the player amount grew significantly, and to a scale nobody expected it, yet the trading method stayed the same (as it's the only tool we have to do it). This ends up taking us to the current day where there are far more scammers taking advantage of this (by now) obsolete procedure, as you can see from the almost day-to-day person in Global/Trade saying "don't trade with X guy because he's a ditto scammer". It appears by now it's cleary taking it's toll to the staff as it's becoming far too common.

Simply telling the player to not "pay upfront" and providing some unappealing tips isn't gonna completely stop this problem, by this point this should be addressed differently

Edited December 29, 2023 by Servor5555

[Barrelztitor]

Hard on agree, been noticing alot of scams happening to some people in discords or whatever, this thing needs to be dealt with

[XanarchyNL]

Agreed, much needed for the health of the game. Will also help staff out as well with reducing the number of scam support tickets. Win win for everyone

[RysPicz]

There is nothing to add, just straight up great suggestion which helps the game a huge lot. Instant upvote

[Cheemsito]

+1. I was told the same the last time I got scammed and I've been buying my Dittos from GTL since then because yeah, paying for each trade is a huge pain and makes the whole process way tedious and slower than it already is.

[tclarkson92]

Bears response is completely unacceptable. 

 

Regardless how many transactions, if proof and confirmation of a 'full box for 'X' amount' is provided, the full funds should be refunded. 

 

[drakesstepson]

as a buyer, i know i might end up forgetting to pay the 16k for at least one transaction, essentially scamming the seller on accident. and as a seller, they cant keep track of that with a trade log since 12+ trades fill up an entire trade log. this is why i pay upfront and dm the player that i paid upfront. 

[Strodex]

I agree with the suggestion, I know some people get a middle man like a CM or GM to oversee the trade

[Exodos]

Don't worry, you just have to wait for a CERTAIN GROUP OF PLAYERS to be scammed, after that we will magically have a surprise update with a mechanic that can "fill" that request 🙂

[Minks]

that is an insane answer from @Bearminator btw, threatening ur own players is bad enough, even worse then they are the victims of theft lol.

 

and yea, good suggestion.

[Strodex]

14 minutes ago, Minks said:

that is an insane answer from @Bearminator btw, threatening ur own players is bad enough, even worse then they are the victims of theft lol.

 

and yea, good suggestion.

It's not really a threat, it's just explaining how they handle these sorts of situations. Still a terrible response, but we shouldn't make something bigger than it is

[Quinzy18]

I love this suggestion and the problems for players it could solve. I have never done full-box trades but the time commitment is the main reason why I haven't. When real life can easily get in the way (kids, other family, school/work) it's important to be able to step away for even just a couple minutes without worries of being an accidental scammer. Not to mention what drakesstepson said:

On 12/30/2023 at 12:51 AM, drakesstepson said:

as a buyer, i know i might end up forgetting to pay the 16k for at least one transaction, essentially scamming the seller on accident. and as a seller, they cant keep track of that with a trade log since 12+ trades fill up an entire trade log. this is why i pay upfront and dm the player that i paid upfront. 

This feature could help with a lot of these situations.

 

However, I'd like to play (dev)il's advocate (sorry, I love you devs! I just saw it and new it'd give some people a laugh. You're amazing and I consider you angels more than anything for the amazing community you have helped build, and the time and effort you put into this amazing game). Let's analyze the potential problems this time-saving feature could introduce.

 

How would the full-box trading work? In a trade you select an option to trade an entire PC box instead of the specific Pokemon. You select a box to trade with that person, they select the money, bah dah bing bah dah boom you're done. However, you realize after the trade you selected the box next to the intended trading box, and it had all of your shinies/OU/storyline/2012/other valuable mons in it, because that's how you organize your boxes. You ask them to trade you back but they refuse. You put in a request to the devs for help. But because of this time-saving full-box trading feature, you felt confident that you wouldn't be scammed, so you didn't grab screenshots of verbal confirmation of what exactly you were trading, have no log of it, and didn't take a recording of the transaction. How are the devs to check that the shinies or other mons weren't part of the intended trade? I don't know, but it sounds a lot more high stakes and stressful than the current situation to me.

 

Please leave other ideas about how to mitigate this issue or other issues the devs may cross when looking into this feature. I'd love to see this feature implemented, but we and the devs should consider the potential problems that could arise from such an implementation. If we can help them, all the more power to use as the users of the feature.

[Poratne]

On 1/19/2024 at 3:13 PM, Quinzy18 said:

How would the full-box trading work? In a trade you select an option to trade an entire PC box instead of the specific Pokemon. You select a box to trade with that person, they select the money, bah dah bing bah dah boom you're done. However, you realize after the trade you selected the box next to the intended trading box, and it had all of your shinies/OU/storyline/2012/other valuable mons in it, because that's how you organize your boxes. You ask them to trade you back but they refuse. You put in a request to the devs for help. But because of this time-saving full-box trading feature, you felt confident that you wouldn't be scammed, so you didn't grab screenshots of verbal confirmation of what exactly you were trading, have no log of it, and didn't take a recording of the transaction. How are the devs to check that the shinies or other mons weren't part of the intended trade? I don't know, but it sounds a lot more high stakes and stressful than the current situation to me.

 

Please leave other ideas about how to mitigate this issue or other issues the devs may cross when looking into this feature. I'd love to see this feature implemented, but we and the devs should consider the potential problems that could arise from such an implementation. If we can help them, all the more power to use as the users of the feature.

The main problem is that they might refuse the money refund in the future once u submitted evidence, if that wasn't the case this suggestion wouldn't have been made. 

To counter their "Dont pay upfront, pay per 5 dittos" is why I suggested this idea.

Nonetheless, refusing money is just not right to the person who got scammed, provided the evidence AND being lectured. When they are (so to say) the victim in this situation yet being treated like they're doing the wrong thing by trusting an other player who had malicious intentions from the start. 
(especially since we're the one also getting rid of those scammers by reporting them)

My idea was that ur able to see the contents of the box before trading it, or when u might trade more valuable Pokemon that ud get a pop-up like the ones u get when u try to delete them. 

Edited January 22 by Poratne

[Johnwaynee]

If they want to push further to shiny hunting and make it also more comfortable for the player itself, they shouldnt do it half baked like so many other features.

Adding the ability to trade full boxes, wether dittos, field breeder or whatever - feels almost mandatory or at least like real high priority since ditto farming/selling is more popular than ever. 
 

just look at the upvotes and reactions within the shortest amount of time. Speaks for itself. 

Edited January 22 by Johnwaynee

[enzo172014]

I actually agree with the devs on this. What happened to copy and paste? 

 

There is no real harm in an extra click of the mouse and pressing 2 buttons on your keyboard to ensure your transaction is safe. 

If you are on the buying side, copy $x Yen and paste it every trade while the other player is adding the dittos. That will not be very hard. Unless you're playing on mobile.

 

This also, DOES NOT slow you down. You can add the yen while the other player is adding the dittos. 

 

All I can see here is people pushing for a feature they wanted (w/c is good and I would want as well btw.) while disregarding their common senses. 

[Fiiity25]

On 1/19/2024 at 11:13 AM, Quinzy18 said:

I love this suggestion and the problems for players it could solve. I have never done full-box trades but the time commitment is the main reason why I haven't. When real life can easily get in the way (kids, other family, school/work) it's important to be able to step away for even just a couple minutes without worries of being an accidental scammer. Not to mention what drakesstepson said:

This feature could help with a lot of these situations.

 

However, I'd like to play (dev)il's advocate (sorry, I love you devs! I just saw it and new it'd give some people a laugh. You're amazing and I consider you angels more than anything for the amazing community you have helped build, and the time and effort you put into this amazing game). Let's analyze the potential problems this time-saving feature could introduce.

 

How would the full-box trading work? In a trade you select an option to trade an entire PC box instead of the specific Pokemon. You select a box to trade with that person, they select the money, bah dah bing bah dah boom you're done. However, you realize after the trade you selected the box next to the intended trading box, and it had all of your shinies/OU/storyline/2012/other valuable mons in it, because that's how you organize your boxes. You ask them to trade you back but they refuse. You put in a request to the devs for help. But because of this time-saving full-box trading feature, you felt confident that you wouldn't be scammed, so you didn't grab screenshots of verbal confirmation of what exactly you were trading, have no log of it, and didn't take a recording of the transaction. How are the devs to check that the shinies or other mons weren't part of the intended trade? I don't know, but it sounds a lot more high stakes and stressful than the current situation to me.

 

Please leave other ideas about how to mitigate this issue or other issues the devs may cross when looking into this feature. I'd love to see this feature implemented, but we and the devs should consider the potential problems that could arise from such an implementation. If we can help them, all the more power to use as the users of the feature.

I think this full box trading is more focused on the specific ditto traders and not so much on someone casual who put together a box of dittos because he was bored and wanted to sell them.
and if you are a specific ditto trader you will have everything arranged to choose X box of dittos, I don't think that whoever is dedicated to this will have them scattered in different boxes mixed with other pokemon.
and at most, the system should have a specific button that lets you see your list of boxes or better yet, when you press that button, it should open the "my pc" tab and you can manage it normally, with the option of "multiselect" and all that, so many errors would be avoided.

[Poratne]

3 hours ago, enzo172014 said:

I actually agree with the devs on this. What happened to copy and paste? 

 

There is no real harm in an extra click of the mouse and pressing 2 buttons on your keyboard to ensure your transaction is safe. 

If you are on the buying side, copy $x Yen and paste it every trade while the other player is adding the dittos. That will not be very hard. Unless you're playing on mobile.

 

This also, DOES NOT slow you down. You can add the yen while the other player is adding the dittos. 

 

All I can see here is people pushing for a feature they wanted (w/c is good and I would want as well btw.) while disregarding their common senses. 

Genuinely I dont mind when people think differently on this suggestion, but did u read the other comments and their opinions. All of them were different and very understandable.

Its like I stated, a way to solve this problem (the increase of reports regarding ditto scams) could be resolved due to this. Its a feature that helps BOTH PARTIES, cause I sure as hell know that majority of the players still will pay upfront instead of "x amount per 5 dittos".

I personally don't believe its justified of higher staff to expect a player to change how they purchase stuff, instead of trying to come up with the solution themselves, cause lets say 1 of the 50 players would only pay per 5 dittos, that still wouldn't resolve the main problem at hand. 

In the end they'd only do harm to the community by refusing to restore scammed money, as shown in the ticket reply that has been send to me and others. Its not an selfish suggestion, I agree its a quality of life change, but it's for both parties. 

[Anon000]

Would be a huge quality life changing, please consider this. 

[Akshit]

If this happens I'll gladly spend billions and start an egg shunt with non stop donators and shiny charms.

 

Get this added please. 

Good experience and prevent hassle / scam for players.

More money for DEVs too as it would encourage more shunting, etc which is a big money sink.

 

Really happy to see such a great suggestion. Just imagining a world where this would be implemented makes me wanna sell my assets.

Let's goooooo!

Edited January 25 by Akshit

[Goku]

On 12/28/2023 at 4:59 PM, Poratne said:

feature where we can trade FULL boxes only for X amount of $. 
 

That's a great suggestion!

[lobon]

I believe this is a good suggestion, and I don't see why it should not be added. It would benefit the players with faster and simpler box trading, egg shunting, and even reducing scams. Not just that, but I would also think it would benefit the staff as well because trade-related scams would decrease, which means tickets and reports regarding trading would decrease, and that is a good thing because then the staff wouldn't have to waste so much time on those kinds of reports, and that should give them the opportunity to focus more on other things and issues. Honestly, why would you not want this in the game after the reasons I gave you? It's. a win-win solution. Also to the developers, it would be nice to have one of you address this subject. Knowing that this has 100+ votes, some acknowledgement or statement of this suggestion would be nice. To everyone else, if you disagree with me, I would like to know why.

Edited January 25 by lobon

[enzo172014]

16 hours ago, Poratne said:

Its like I stated, a way to solve this problem (the increase of reports regarding ditto scams) could be resolved due to this. Its a feature that helps BOTH PARTIES, cause I sure as hell know that majority of the players still will pay upfront instead of "x amount per 5 dittos".

I personally don't believe its justified of higher staff to expect a player to change how they purchase stuff, instead of trying to come up with the solution themselves, cause lets say 1 of the 50 players would only pay per 5 dittos, that still wouldn't resolve the main problem at hand. 

In the end they'd only do harm to the community by refusing to restore scammed money, as shown in the ticket reply that has been send to me and others. Its not an selfish suggestion, I agree its a quality of life change, but it's for both parties. 

Majority including me will also want ditto box trading feature. Who does not want an easier way to trade Dittos. Of course everyone will want that.

 

My main point here is, why would you say the "pay $x per trade" is not solving the issue? If you use this method, you will NEVER be scammed because the trade will not happen unless you are checking the trade details (w/c definitely is your fault). Thus, resolving the ditto scam issue.

 

1 out of 50 will do the pay per trade option? I don't think so. But if your numbers (WITHOUT BASIS) is correct, it is the fault of the 49 people's fault they were scammed. It is not the dev's fault if the players cannot or refuse to follow a simple rule.

 

Lastly, it does not harm the community if they don't restore the scammed money. I think, it will make the community better because the community will be more resilient to correct and just suggestions they are providing. You can argue here that the dev's are not always correct but they are correct this time.

Edited January 25 by enzo172014

[XanarchyNL]

1 hour ago, enzo172014 said:

My main point here is, why would you say the "pay $x per trade" is not solving the issue? If you use this method, you will NEVER be scammed because the trade will not happen unless you are checking the trade details (w/c definitely is your fault). Thus, resolving the ditto scam issue.

Very easy to forget to add money into the trade. Happens all the time