Frag Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 I don't think this is the right time to talk about a split, we haven't a matchmaking system working yet. This seems just like a desperate move by the staff to reduce the gap between new and old players. epicdavenport, dedegendut, OldKeith and 6 others 9 Link to comment
BenGorgon Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) I would love to see the split made. Yes, it would radically change the metagame. Is this a bad thing? No, especially not right now. It would encourage people to eat their godly Pokemon in favor of a choice move set or better spread. This very well could be the level playing field factor that keeps both classes of players active in the system. Mechanically it could work very well with a few slight changes. I would recommend that Steel is coded to resist Dragon right off the bat, otherwise we will see the Gen 4 Dragon syndrome where anything with a Dragon-type STAB is shoved to Ubers. While I don't think this would be too terrible all things considered, it would generally have a nice balancing effect imo. Ban The Dragons! I would really love to see this. It just makes so much more sense with everything PokeMMO is doing right now, and will help new players acclimate more easily into what they know. Edited January 2, 2015 by BenGorgon berzerk428 1 Link to comment
codylramey Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 As exciting as the idea may be i think that no matter how much discussion we have if you were to rush this into the next update it will cause many problems. Idk what kind of problems it will cause but i know that it will cause them. Imo the best thing to do is move forward with the update, leave this open for discussion, lead TS discussions about this with the tier counsils, and if what amanue says is possible Thinknice did something like this in the other game, but we can use showdown to experiment with the things proposed here. If enough people are willing to try, we can set up tourneys, or just duel over there with whatever mechanic or changes we would want in Pokemmo. then do this. Maybe you can even hold cash prize or godly breeder poke prize tournies using this method to get ppl willing to test it. If you dont want to use showdown then you can use the PTS (Spawning us the pokes we need ofc) Noad 1 Link to comment
Senile Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) I would love to see the split made. Yes, it would radically change the metagame. Is this a bad thing? No, especially not right now. It would encourage people to eat their godly Pokemon in favor of a choice move set or better spread. This very well could be the level playing field factor that keeps both classes of players active in the system. Mechanically it could work very well with a few slight changes. I would recommend that Steel is coded to resist Dragon right off the bat, otherwise we will see the Gen 4 Dragon syndrome where anything with a Dragon-type STAB is shoved to Ubers. While I don't think this would be too terrible all things considered, it would generally have a nice balancing effect imo. I would really love to see this. It just makes so much more sense with everything PokeMMO is doing right now, and will help new players acclimate more easily into what they know. Steel already resists Dragon, and I have no idea why you were under the impression they didn't. As exciting as the idea may be i think that no matter how much discussion we have if you were to rush this into the next update it will cause many problems. Idk what kind of problems it will cause but i know that it will cause them. Imo the best thing to do is move forward with the update, leave this open for discussion, lead TS discussions about this with the tier counsils, and if what amanue says is possible then do this. Maybe you can even hold cash prize or godly breeder poke prize tournies using this method to get ppl willing to test it. If you dont want to use showdown then you can use the PTS (Spawning us the pokes we need ofc) You're implying that TS discussions haven't already happened, m8. The point of this thread is to find the problems it will cause. Edited January 2, 2015 by Senile Zehkar 1 Link to comment
codylramey Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 As for what other mechanics could be added. I think that team preview would help out a lot. With the split a lot of pokes are going to gain a lot of power. Senile said that one reason why they are able to have all of those unwallable powerhouses in l8er gens is bc with the team preview you are able to see from the beginning what pokes on ur team you need to keep alive for their which pokes. Link to comment
Senile Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 As for what other mechanics could be added. I think that team preview would help out a lot. With the split a lot of pokes are going to gain a lot of power. Senile said that one reason why they are able to have all of those unwallable powerhouses in l8er gens is bc with the team preview you are able to see from the beginning what pokes on ur team you need to keep alive for their which pokes. It's more complicated than that, really. Anyway, team preview was 5th gen+, and it was incredibly important in 5th gen because knowing what weather your opponent's team used was a big deal. We really don't need it. Link to comment
BenGorgon Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Steel already resists Dragon, and I have no idea why you were under the impression they didn't. My bad, I was under the impression that this was a change added in Gen 6 when they redid Steel resistances. The reason I thought this, is beyond me. Link to comment
Bestfriendss Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 As exciting as the idea may be i think that no matter how much discussion we have if you were to rush this into the next update it will cause many problems. Idk what kind of problems it will cause but i know that it will cause them. Imo the best thing to do is move forward with the update, leave this open for discussion, lead TS discussions about this with the tier counsils, and if what amanue says is possible then do this. Maybe you can even hold cash prize or godly breeder poke prize tournies using this method to get ppl willing to test it. If you dont want to use showdown then you can use the PTS (Spawning us the pokes we need ofc) Senile is right, I saw him, Darkshade, and Tyrone chatting about it in my channel. I am predicting that the split is very likely to happen. RIP: HP Ghost Ursaring, HP Flying Mance, and HP Ghost Breloom Link to comment
KingBowser Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Most important though, Rip Xcel's hp fly Aero. Kiliminati, BlueStar, OldKeith and 18 others 21 Link to comment
Winterbrah Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 i want this cuz im selfish and my comps are already outdated anyway axx and Arkhelien 2 Link to comment
OldKeith Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Most important though, Rip Xcel's hp fly Aero. Must have already dropped to 50 million. ErrorGlumac 1 Link to comment
KingBowser Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) i want this cuz im selfish and my comps are already outdated anyway I dont really think it oudates too many comps. The major ones I can think of are, crunch/pursuit snorlax, timid houndoom and like Crunch ursaring. You can still add the elemental punches/tms to them like most other pokes. I still stay rich, and does this really shorten the gap between new and old players? Edited January 2, 2015 by KingBowser Link to comment
codylramey Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Not all comps would become out of date. Most can just be re EVd and Re movesetted. Physical HP pokes would obvio be rip. E punch zam (which lets face it who uses zam anyway) would prolly do with jsut a new move set. Snorlaxes everwhere will prolly have to be rebred tho. You need crunch instead of Sball which i believe would have to be bred into him. Wow way to ninja me Bowser. Edited January 2, 2015 by codylramey Link to comment
DyzZyt Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Honestly, it's past time that change happens, it is well LOGICAL a physical move to physical damage and not so special because of the type, it become the most competitive and advanced PokeMMO more realistically. Whether will like it or not, this is the future of competitive and generations! berzerk428 1 Link to comment
OldKeith Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 This does not close the gap at all. We have the godly things, we can rebreed, reev and change their sets easily. We have the resources to. The question should be if a gen 3 game should have the split, and I think it should not. We either dive into 4 gen fully, or stay away from the split for good. jayfeatskydd, londark and magorax 3 Link to comment
felix Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Senile is right, I saw him, Darkshade, and Tyrone chatting about it in my channel. I am predicting that the split is very likely to happen. RIP: HP Ghost Ursaring, HP Flying Mance, and HP Ghost Breloom Ursaring would be able to use Crunch, way better than hp ghost. Snorlax maybe be a ubers assets, fire punch, crunch ( not sure if it can learn pursuit in this game, but pursuit lax would be a thing to watch out) Link to comment
codylramey Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Another thing to consider is that each update helps keep the game fresh for older players. After a while of playing any game will get stale. Then when you update you have new things to explore. Breeding was one of the biggest, it was a game changer in so many ways. Now we are going to have hoenn do that yet again. If you implement this split in this update you are giving up an opportunity to freshen the game up a bit for older players. Instead of aving Hoenn to change the game and then in a year pr two Spcl physical split to change the game yet again we will be getting it all at the same time, experience it all at once, and get bored of it all at once. I hope that makes since. I know its not a very strong argument against it but i thought it was worth pointing out. Edited January 2, 2015 by codylramey Link to comment
magorax Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Ok srs Dclaw though 252+ Atk Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 217-256 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 14.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and after just 1 layer of spikes 252+ Atk Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 217-256 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery Link to comment
codylramey Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Ok srs Dclaw though 252+ Atk Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 217-256 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 14.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and after just 1 layer of spikes 252+ Atk Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 217-256 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery mence would be banned. He was banned in gen 4 and im sure they had more to deal with him than we do. Link to comment
YagamiNoir Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Ok srs Dclaw though 252+ Atk Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 217-256 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 14.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and after just 1 layer of spikes 252+ Atk Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Vaporeon: 217-256 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery That's a wrong calc, by a little bit though. Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw (just change HP Flying in gen 3 calcs to 80 BP and you get the same thing) vs. Vaporeon: 113-133 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- 28.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw vs. Vaporeon: 113-133 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery Edited January 2, 2015 by YagamiNoir4896 Link to comment
magorax Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) mence would be banned. He was banned in gen 4 and im sure they had more to deal with him than we do. Dragonite 1 less atk stat, and the results are the same. Drago wasn't banned in Gen 4. Are we just gunna go around banning several pokes? Not to mention how thunderpunch metagross might be That's a wrong calc, by a little bit though. Choice Band Salamence Dragon Claw (just change HP Flying in gen 3 calcs to 80 BP and you get the same thing) vs. Vaporeon: 113-133 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- 28.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery Choice Band Salamence Hidden Power Flying vs. Vaporeon: 113-133 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery Ok ty man, even proving my point further m8 Edited January 2, 2015 by magorax Link to comment
Herpetology Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Not unless we're getting the entirety of gen 4, otherwise keep that sort of shit out. People will have enough of a challenge just getting the few new competitive Pokemon being introduced to their respective tiers after this update because of how difficult breeding is now. Now we have to rebreed and re-ev the old ones too? Edited January 2, 2015 by Herpetology magorax 1 Link to comment
Senile Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 mence would be banned. He was banned in gen 4 and im sure they had more to deal with him than we do. Except for the part where we don't have base 120 Outrage, AKA "The Move That Made Dragons Broken In 4th Gen" (basically, that's a really bad comparison. that's not the only reason the comparison is bad, but outrage is a pretty big reason) Link to comment
Gilan Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 For me it sounds like a good idea. It will open up some pokemon (mainly sharpedo and sneasle for me) to be used. Also I would vote that you attach it to the breeding/Hoenn update Link to comment
codylramey Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Except for the part where we don't have base 120 Outrage, AKA "The Move That Made Dragons Broken In 4th Gen" (basically, that's a really bad comparison. that's not the only reason the comparison is bad, but outrage is a pretty big reason) Oh i didnt realize that it was outrage that got him banned. That would explain why dnite was able to stay. Link to comment
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