NU Tier Discussion Request Thread

[caioxlive13]

8 hours ago, RysPicz said:

Bronzor or Golbat (Stone edge vs Smack Down). 

 

 

You just forget that smack down stops a bit golbat for entering. Reason? If on switch-in you use smack down golbat become susceptible to a earthquake and because of that it has to enter via pivot to not risk being KO'ed after enter. 

[DoubleJ]

Impish Golbat outspeeds Torterra and only takes 30% from Adamant Life Orb Smack Down on the switch, delivering a deadly 77% damage with Brave Bird or 30% with U-Turn.

 

+2 Adamant Life Orb Smack Down is only 57% top damage, so Golbat still gets to hit it. 

 

Golbat is a legend and Torterra would be better served with Stone Edge to check it. 

 

You wouldn't understand though. 

[caioxlive13]

4 minutes ago, DoubleJ said:

Impish Golbat outspeeds Torterra and only takes 30% from Adamant Life Orb Smack Down on the switch, delivering a deadly 77% damage with Brave Bird or 30% with U-Turn.

 

+2 Adamant Life Orb Smack Down is only 57% top damage, so Golbat still gets to hit it. 

 

Golbat is a legend and Torterra would be better served with Stone Edge to check it. 

 

You wouldn't understand though. 

what i mean is you can't go like, mindless switch with golbat in front of a torterra that revealed smack down, because if he uses on the turn you're switching, you will be susceptible on the next turn to a quake. Golbat is more likely a check to torterra. It can counter it, but need to watch out on switch-in.

[xStarr]

Torterra will be perfectly fine in NU.

Jolly SS reaches 236 [+2]

Ada SS reaches 216 [+2]

Walls/Tanks

Spoiler

+2 252 Atk Torterra Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Druddigon: 117-138 (63.5 - 75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252 Atk Torterra Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Leafeon: 61-72 (35.4 - 41.8%) -- 87.2% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252 Atk Torterra Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 63-75 (30.5 - 36.4%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252+ Atk Torterra Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Golbat: 134-158 (73.6 - 86.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252+ Atk Torterra Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Escavalier: 117-138 (66.1 - 77.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252 Atk Torterra Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Escavalier: 145-172 (81.9 - 97.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252 Atk Torterra Wood Hammer vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Bronzor: 68-81 (41.4 - 49.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

 

 

Important to note that Stone Edge might be better than Smack down just for the more damage output.

252 Atk Primeape Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Torterra: 144-172 (84.7 - 101.1%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

0 Atk Escavalier Megahorn vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Torterra: 168-200 (98.8 - 117.6%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

0 Atk Golbat Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Torterra: 110-132 (64.7 - 77.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+2 252 Atk Torterra Wood Hammer vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Torterra: 175-207 (102.9 - 121.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO [Consider this Ditto]

0 SpA Tangrowth Hidden Power Fire vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Torterra: 56-68 (32.9 - 40%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO

252 Atk Technician Scyther Wing Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Torterra: 134-158 (78.8 - 92.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Typhlosion Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Torterra: 156-186 (91.7 - 109.4%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Alakazam Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Torterra: 91-108 (53.5 - 63.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Electivire Ice Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Torterra: 160-192 (94.1 - 112.9%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

252+ Atk Piloswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Torterra: 124-148 (72.9 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

 

Edited October 20, 2023 by xStarr

[Azphiel]

With the agreement of a majority of TC members, Articuno was placed in NU. 

[RysPicz]

Good. Fairly sure it's gonna become untiered soon anyway

[epicdavenport]

4 hours ago, RysPicz said:

Good. Fairly sure it's gonna become untiered soon anyway

Boots when?

[RysPicz]

3 minutes ago, epicdavenport said:

Boots when?

jesus I most certainly hope this will not happen anytime soon

[DoubleJ]

On 12/25/2023 at 8:36 AM, RysPicz said:

jesus I most certainly hope this will not happen anytime soon

Volarona, Butterfree, Scyther, and any other set up GOAT gonna run OP

[Onraider]

any discussion on re-evaluating offensive mons like qwilfish now that quagsire might be moving up next month?

[LeJovi]

Letting yanmega drop is insaneee

[Imperial]

Yanmega must surely go to BL2 or have a quick suspect test?

[gbwead]

I don't think Yanmegga would be broken in NU since a few walls can stop it like Gigalith and Golbat. However, I suspect it would be very unhealthy for the NU metagame. Offense would gain a double edge sword with Yanmegga as a powerful tool, but also as what could be an unstoppable threat. 

It might still be worth testing tho. Looking back at 2019, the UU meta didn't have much to deal with Yanmegga (only Crobat and Snorlax really, since Empoleon didn't exist, Milotic was OU and Gigalith was NU). Perhaps Cryogonal would become more viable. It's hard to tell, but honnestly I'm not sure what Offense will be able to do vs Yanmegga.

Edited Monday at 06:12 PM by gbwead

[drewq]

7 hours ago, gbwead said:

I don't think Yanmegga would be broken in NU since a few walls can stop it like Gigalith and Golbat. However, I suspect it would be very unhealthy for the NU metagame. Offense would gain a double edge sword with Yanmegga as a powerful tool, but also as what could be an unstoppable threat. 

It might still be worth testing tho. Looking back at 2019, the UU meta didn't have much to deal with Yanmegga (only Crobat and Snorlax really, since Empoleon didn't exist, Milotic was OU and Gigalith was NU). Perhaps Cryogonal would become more viable. It's hard to tell, but honnestly I'm not sure what Offense will be able to do vs Yanmegga.

I can see specs with u-turn being absolutely disgusting. Speed boost not so much. There's so many pivoting threats now

[gbwead]

28 minutes ago, drewq said:

I can see specs with u-turn being absolutely disgusting. Speed boost not so much. There's so many pivoting threats now

Ya, but I don't see Stall struggling vs Yanmegga. Offense would tho imo.

[razimove]

I dont think golbat is that problematic for yanmega either, assuming you can run psychic on your sets, but why is it even considered to drop to begin with?

[gbwead]

12 minutes ago, razimove said:

I dont think golbat is that problematic for yanmega either, assuming you can run psychic on your sets, but why is it even considered to drop to begin with?

The Psychic situation is very similar when you compare Golbat to Crobat. Obviously, the Speed for Bulk tradeoff has an impact in that match up, but it's not that different.

Edited Tuesday at 05:06 PM by gbwead

[VadimEmpoleon]

I suggest doing a 1 month test for Yanmega in case its usage doesn't rise by the end of the month.

 

I think NU is probably better without Yanmega but there are some mons that can deal with the Choice Specs Tinted Lens variant like Calm Mantine (except HP Electric), Gigalith, Cryogonal, Golbat (except Psychic), Calm Articuno?,  (doesn't seem very good to use for any other purpose), Audino. U-turn seems problematic though.

 

A good part of the sweepers in NU are also faster than Yanmega like Cinccino, Adamant Sceptile, Tauros, Typhlosion, Mismagius, Zoroark, etc. Some have Sturdy like Golem and some have Focus Sash like Froslass.

 

The Speed Boost variant doesn't seem like a big threat and it could be interesting to see it in the tier because it would manage to surpass common mons in NU like Scarf Blaziken and strong threats like Torterra.

 

My main concern about it is U-turn but I think it's worth a try to test it.