July-2023 Movement Discussion

[Munya]

Currently still using old cutoff for this season, 4.36% to go either way.

 

Banned to Ubers from OU:

Gallade - Discussion thread/ban post.

 

To OU from UU:

Salamence - 5.26% OU Usage

 

Banned to BL1 from UU:

Shaymin - Discussion thread/ban post.

 

To UU from OU:

Seismitoad - 3.31% OU usage

Toxicroak - 2.91% OU usage

 

To UU from NU:

Gastrodon - 8.09% UU usage

Zoroark - 5.44% UU usage

Clefable - 4.87% UU usage

Tentacruel - 4.85% UU usage

 

To NU from UU:

Ditto - 3.91% UU usage

Druddigon - 2.08% UU usage

Gigalith - 1.65% UU usage

Gligar - 4.16% UU usage

Mismagius - 3.04% UU usage

Venusaur - 4.02% UU usage

Xatu - 3.83% UU usage

 

NU Suspect Test:

Venomoth - TC approved, discussion thread

[Justa102]

Since Salamence is leaving UU, that takes away a big crawdaunt check since bold mence is now gone, and with shaymin potentially going away aswell has there been any talk of a crawdaunt discussion? only having poliwrath as a reliable check is not good and crawdaunt will become centralizing once again like before.

 

That being said, don't allow Shaymin to remain in the tier because of this please having something op to counter another op mon is not the way to do it.

[RysPicz]

Please don't allow Saur into NU for the sake of god

[Onraider]

Any reason pz isn't being reevaluated to be added to UU again?

[Munya]

1 hour ago, RysPicz said:

Please don't allow Saur into NU for the sake of god

They can initiate a vote for a quick ban if necessary, the bar is high for a quick ban though.

[BaliAds]

14 minutes ago, Munya said:

They can initiate a vote for a quick ban if necessary, the bar is high for a quick ban though.

What about the request for a discussion? Why has nothing been said to that yet and will anything be done about this, I think most of the community can see venu is a problem in nu especially now that both Clefable and Tentacruel are leaving?

[Munya]

20 minutes ago, BaliAds said:

What about the request for a discussion? Why has nothing been said to that yet and will anything be done about this, I think most of the community can see venu is a problem in nu especially now that both Clefable and Tentacruel are leaving?

The movement thread was just made this morning, nobody has had a chance to propose a discussion.

 

 

EDIT: OP had been updated with Gallade ban. Still awaiting shaymin post.

[BaliAds]

I proposed one pre-empting the move down:

https://forums.pokemmo.com/index.php?/topic/73557-nu-tier-discussion-request-thread/&do=findComment&comment=2009833

What should I do in this scenario?

 

[Munya]

First, I'm not going to expect any of TC to make a thread before usage movements are actually finalized, things change even if it may seem unlikely.  As for your next step, garner enough support from a member of TC to where they will draft a thread for review/posting.  Only need to convince one.

[Imperial]

2 hours ago, Justa102 said:

Since Salamence is leaving UU, that takes away a big crawdaunt check since bold mence is now gone, and with shaymin potentially going away aswell has there been any talk of a crawdaunt discussion? only having poliwrath as a reliable check is not good and crawdaunt will become centralizing once again like before.

 

That being said, don't allow Shaymin to remain in the tier because of this please having something op to counter another op mon is not the way to do it.

Not saying that Crawdaunt is fine, because it's a problem, but we're now getting Toxicroak again so we'll be back to seeing Toxicroak + Poliwrath being spammed in the tier assuming Shaymin gets banned.

 

Regarding the changes, I would propose the following:

• Venusaur - Quick banned to BL2 under offensive characteristics due to its HA (I believe this mon will be too strong under sun compared to Exeggutor/Victreebell/Typhlosion etc)
• Cloyster - As it avoided the cut off, does TC think that Cloyster is healthy for the tier or should a discussion thread be warranted?
• Gigalith - This was fine when it was in the tier last time, but people are saying it's going to be an issue (I personally disagree), so curious what TC members think about this mon?

[Yaser]

and shaymin? 

[Luke]

11 key shifts for NU. Surely there is a way to make this less extreme, right? I have been slightly out the loop for a few months now but cmon this just seems insane.

[Queza]

Looks fun, this is good news asides from what incog said. Ditto, Mismag + xatu in nu is some hype

[caioxlive13]

Gallade gone, worst decision possible. Without doubt the argument to not ban was best. 

"Gallade Broke a lot Walls" - and? Crawdaunt under a Rain also do that, Darma can do that. They are perfectly fine on metagaming. 

Gallade lacks speed, 80 is very slow for OU standarts. It lacks a part of One/Two-Hit KOs without Life Orb, and lacks Speed that it really need without Scarf. Also the 4mss mentioned on discussion thread. How a mon that can't had the coverage it need due to lack of moves, and had the same problem with items, are remotely close to be bannable?

[DoubleJ]

2 hours ago, Luke said:

11 key shifts for NU. Surely there is a way to make this less extreme, right? I have been slightly out the loop for a few months now but cmon this just seems insane.

Things are going to be different for the summer season and beyond. We're aiming to make changes to the cutoffs to avoid these kind of shifts moving forward. 

 

Chao must have finally gotten a couple ladder wins spamming Gallade.

[gbwead]

Venomoth to NU plz. No reason for it to remain BL, especially with Gigalith in NU to counter it.

[Munya]

I'll outsource the writeup to you, I'm of the opinion its been banned long enough to warrant a test at the very least as well.

[TohnR]

7 hours ago, Onraider said:

Any reason pz isn't being reevaluated to be added to UU again?

Any reason why it should ? I don't really see how Toxicroak/Seismitoard/Salamence/Shaymin changes affect PZ in any way, if anything these changes make PZ stronger in UU as the tier loses 2 top tier threats that were faster than it. Besides the recovery changes make PZ case even worse in UU

 

5 hours ago, Imperial said:

Not saying that Crawdaunt is fine, because it's a problem, but we're now getting Toxicroak again so we'll be back to seeing Toxicroak + Poliwrath being spammed in the tier assuming Shaymin gets banned.

 

There's also Venusaur & Empoleon that got added (right ?)+ Leafeon is virtually buffed because of the Recovery PP Nerf (since it uses Wish).
Not saying that means Crawdaunt is fine but it's not at the same point it used to be. 

 

 

On another note, UU usage changes will be irrelevant in just a while as the whole meta changes without Mence/Shaymin.
Mons such as Gligar, Gigalith & Druddigon will surely bounce back up above the cutoff in the upcomming months.
I'm not entirely sure how you can deal with it but there'll surely be more instability in NU because of that. 

 

Edited June 25, 2023 by TohnR

[Rigox507]

gigalith is back, it's time to get back in the game

how do they take my clefable😔

 

[andos111]

As always the tier changes made by the uga buga staff 
Thanks to a couple of crybabies, we get to play OU with crayons and chalk.

[Godhelll]

I think these are interesting and legitimate changes. Perhaps it was not so necessary to make Salamence back to OU and Gastrodon would've probably be able to stay in NU tier. Venusaur has no place in NU unfortunately even if I like the pokemon in general.

 

Quote

Thanks to a couple of crybabies, we get to play OU with crayons and chalk.

Looks like you're the only crybaby on this topic... no wait, you're not alone, there is caio too... but with him we are used to.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Godhelll

[caioxlive13]

38 minutes ago, Godhelll said:

I think these are interesting and legitimate changes. Perhaps it was not so necessary to make Salamence back to OU. Venusaur has no place in NU unfortunately even if I like the pokemon in general.

 

Looks like you're the only crybaby on this topic... no wait, you're not alone, there is caio too... but with him we are used to.

We are not crybabies. We give a argument but TC seems to have ignored it, and playerbase was &$@#&$# on players that tried to defend gallade's stay without they managing to building a consistent counterargument.

 

We win with good arguments, weak players #&@$# on us instead of try to prove us wrong. If wanna discuss with us, don't bring offense words, bring a argument

Edited June 25, 2023 by caioxlive13

[Godhelll]

17 minutes ago, caioxlive13 said:

We are not crybabies. We give a argument but TC seems to have ignored it, and playerbase was &$@#&$# on players that tried to defend gallade's stay without they managing to building a consistent counterargument.

 

We win with good arguments, weak players #&@$# on us instead of try to prove us wrong. If wanna discuss with us, don't bring offense words, bring a argument

My friend, your argument is to compare Darmanitan to Gallade, it is quite obvious that the members of the TC do not take this kind of comments into consideration.

 

I never talked bad, I only quoted and repeated the terminologies of your friend

[caioxlive13]

Just now, Godhelll said:

My friend, your argument is to compare Darmanitan to Gallade, it is quite obvious that the members of the TC do not take this kind of comments into consideration.

 

I never talked bad, I only quoted and repeated the terminologies of your friend

I'm comparing a mon and other because both had the EXACT SAME ROLE and had the same good and bad points(good: high dmg output, s**** on most walls, bad: No speed without scarf, bad defenses, can't do a *** on offenses, etc...) and it's a good way to explain what can happen when the weakness got exploited.

[Luke]

39 minutes ago, caioxlive13 said:

We are not crybabies. We give a argument but TC seems to have ignored it, and playerbase was &$@#&$# on players that tried to defend gallade's stay without they managing to building a consistent counterargument.

 

We win with good arguments, weak players #&@$# on us instead of try to prove us wrong. If wanna discuss with us, don't bring offense words, bring a argument

As a former TC member, I can say that I had you blocked while I was in TC (and still do), and I know many other TC members have you blocked. You spam threads with nonsense and steer the conversation in an unproductive manner. I know you mean no harm, but that doesn't mean I have to willingly expose myself to what you say. You actively ignored me many times when I refuted your points and continued on as if you were some sort of rogue AI. I am not the only person with an experience like this. You need to stop being so aggressive and actually back your points up with evidence.

Edited June 26, 2023 by Luke